You're listening to This Naked Mind with Annie Grace. Hi, this is Annie Grace, and welcome to This Naked Mind podcast. I'm here with Jana. Hi, Jana. How are you? Great. Hi. Thanks for having me on.
Oh, I'm so glad that you're here. Why don't you take us back to the beginning in your journey with alcohol? Where did it all start for you?
I would say it started a little later in my life. I didn't really grow up with alcohol in my family. I was raised by my mom and my aunt. I remember that they would occasionally drink on holidays or special occasions, but it wasn't a regular thing at all in my household. So I didn't grow up around alcohol. And even in high school,
I just wasn't interested in it. I did watch my friend's drink, but I never really got into it. I didn't go to college, but when I was 19, I moved out to Mendocino County and marijuana is a big thing in Mendocino County. So I did smoke pot and I just didn't really drink. And then,
When I was 25, I got married and we moved to Hawaii. And I think of my drinking, I started drinking a little bit more just because there was no marijuana or I had to pay for it for the first time in my life. So I wasn't smoking. Maybe I was drinking a little bit more. But after three years, my ex has been asked, did he want to be separated? And that was really emotional for me, really hard for me.
It brought up a lot of old heart wounds from when I was a childhood, not having my dad in my life. It just brought up a huge amount of pain, feelings of rejection, not being lovable. And I don't think I was really emotionally able to
know how to handle that or take care of myself. And I had a roommate who just happened to have a bottle of wine every night and we would share this bottle of wine and talk and it helped numb that pain. I was also in a little bit of a denial about how much it hurt. I wanted to be strong and I'm okay and I don't need a man.
So I think the alcohol helped mask what I was really feeling, which was total devastation. And I did set off on this whole journey of self love and dating myself and.
Getting to know myself. I went to yoga teacher training. I had a quest for spirituality and went to therapist. I was definitely on a self-love journey. But the drinking, I think it was just a social thing for me for a long time. A social lubricant, it was just what you do as an adult. Get together with friends for drinks. Then I moved back home from Hawaii back to California.
I did date someone who was a big drinker. So I think things like that, my drinking would escalate just with who I was hanging out with. And by the time I moved back to Mendocino County, which I really consider my home, I really love Mendocino County, I do know that I was pretty much a daily drinker by then. So this would have been in my 30s, late 30s, like 38.
all my friends were drinking just as much as me. I did have more older friends for whatever reason, but all the social gatherings we were drinking, my roommate, we drink every afternoon, evening.
And then I got a job in a tasting room in the wine industry. And that's where my drinking really escalated because it was completely normalized. Everyone I worked with loved to drink wine. And we would start drinking about four o'clock, though the winery didn't close till five, but
4 o'clock was the acceptable time to start drinking. But actually it was kind of acceptable to taste wine all throughout the day, starting with the morning. When you would come in for work, we would open the bottles and taste through all the wines to make sure the bottles weren't corked that everything was good, tasted good.
And a funny thing where you could tell who was hungover because they would be the first one to work so that they could open the bottles and try the wine and get that little pair of the dog. And anytime we came in with the hangover, it was laughed about and just have a glass of wine work, it's fine.
you'll get through the day and then four o'clock will come and you can drink and feel better and we would hang out till about six o'clock so from four to six we would be drinking at work and luckily I lived right across the highway from where I worked so I didn't have to drive so I would just go home and we would bring any leftover bottles of wine that were still open we would take that home
And if that wasn't enough, I would take home a bottle of wine at more than half price, like 60% off. So it just was so easy to do and just became a normal thing. I definitely did not think that I could be an alcoholic because it wasn't in my family because I didn't grow up with it. My family, they don't drink very much. They have one glass and that's it. They're
considered very healthy normal drinkers. So I did not believe at all that it was possible for me to be an alcoholic or addicted to alcohol. If I ever questioned my drinking, I just thought, well, if it's ever a problem, I'll stop. So I did have a therapist who I had been working with for three years. And she was a great therapist and helped me through a lot of different things.
just came to this point where we weren't moving any further. We were kind of stuck and she kept bringing up, well, maybe have you thought about not drinking and that that really numbs things and could be like avoiding some stuff and I just didn't want to hear it. And so I stopped seeing her, but it did plant a seed. I planted a seed, but I wasn't ready to hear it. So I stopped seeing her. And then I did have a
friend who was a nurse at the clinic. And one day we were out, we went to see a show and we were having a beer in the car before we went into the show. But we started talking about drinking. And I told her that I was drinking a bottle of wine every night. And she was like, yeah, that's too much. And that's all she said. And we went on, but it did. It stuck with me like,
Oh, this might not be healthy. And I'm into health. I do yoga. I'm into a healthy lifestyle. So it did make me start to question the drinking. So then I had another conversation with a friend and I was talking about my weight. You know, it was like summer. I wanted to wear.
bathing suit and I was feeling a little self-conscious and she said, oh, you should just not drink for a month, you'll lose some weight. And I was like, oh, I'll give it a try. And that's when I found that I could not even go one day without drinking wine. I would say, OK, I'm not going to drink today. And well, one thing was,
I would get to work and open a bottle of wine and just the sound of the cork coming out of the bottle was like, oh, like that feeling of like, I kind of want some wine and no, I'm not going to drink today. And I was kind of shocked to see that I could not go even a day without drinking.
So I'm pretty open person. So I was started talking about it with people. And there was a friend that I walked with regularly. And she told me about the alcohol experiment. And it's free and sign up. And I was like, OK, I'll do that.
At the same time, I had just started dating someone and we did it together and it went well. But I do think that I was high on the new relationship. So I was on a different high and.
that relationship, we were on and off trying not to drink, but he was younger than me. And in the end of the relationship, I realized by that time, that was like a year later, I realized I really did want to stop drinking. And I was not going to be able to do that if I stayed in this relationship. So that was the end of that. For a while, I was trying to moderate, I tried to
moderate and the amount I was drinking. It would go okay for maybe a week, but inevitably I would have that night where I would drink too much.
be hung over, feel terrible. So I do remember at some point where I was drinking a bottle bottle of wine a night, sometimes more. And it's hard to say how much it was because I would start at work, have a few glasses, go home, have a few more. So I'm sure it was actually more than a bottle of wine every night. And I would actually go home and go on walks and go work in my garden. And it's not like I had a
terrible life. I didn't have any problems. I never got a DUI. There was nothing big that forced me to look at my drinking. It was more just an inner gut feeling because I would often fall asleep without washing my face or brushing my teeth. And I would wake up at three in the morning with this
sick feeling in my stomach, I was dehydrated, so I would get up drink water brush my teeth wash my face and that shame and. Just this voice in my head was like you have to stop doing this, this is not having major consequences yet, but if you keep going down this path, something bad could happen because.
Like I said, I didn't have never had a DUI, but not for lack of trying as far as I lived in a very rural area where there's no police. So I did definitely drink and drive. Actually, there was one, one time when I whenever I would go out and run my errands because I lived in a very rural area. So I would leave town to go grocery shopping and run my errands and I would always get a cocktail because that was a treat.
to make it more interesting that I was running all these errands. So I would always have my cocktail. And then on the way home, I decided to stop and have another cocktail before I got on this hour-long Y&D mountain road back home. And I started talking to somebody at the bar and they offered to buy me a drink. So I ended up having two
And then I got onto this road and it's curvy. And I got behind somebody who was going really slow and there was two cars, but I could tell it was the front person that was going very slow. And in my mind, oh, they're not from around here and they need to pull over. And I felt like they need to be shown what the correct way of driving is like the correct etiquette, you know, they need to pull over.
So I ended up passing both cars over a double yellow line and got past them. And all the way home, I felt like I had done the right thing that I was justified in driving like that. And I woke up in the middle of the night and instantly it was like, oh my God, just the realization of what could have happened. If there was an oncoming car, that would have been a four car accident.
just how dangerous that was, but that wasn't. Yeah, when I woke up, I felt so differently than I did in that moment when I was driving and felt totally entitled. Like, might you go, you know, that I knew better? I don't know. So that was scary. And I wish I could say that I stopped drinking, but I didn't. I kept drinking.
But I started listening to the Naked Mind podcast. And I remember my first episode that I tuned into. It was a woman from London and she was talking about just how wonderful her life was and she stopped drinking. And she was cheerful and she was so positive and
That was a really great episode. So I started listening every time I got in the car, I would listen to the podcast and listen to the stories. And the stories were so great because it got me to start imagining what my life could be like without alcohol, because I could not imagine my life without alcohol before. But the stories really helped. And I also started thinking about what was my story going to be? Like, how is I going to overcome drinking?
But I want to say that it was extremely hard for me. Once I gave up the idea of moderation and I was fully committed into trying to stop drinking, it was very hard. I would go 10 days and then drink again, you know, 11 days, 16 days, drink again.
One time I went 38 days and I drank again and I had the worst hangover. It was just awful because when I tried to stop drinking, the hangovers got worse because I'd go for a while without it and then drink a bottle of wine or more. And just I had the worst hangover. I took a picture of myself. I wrote myself a letter trying all these different things. One thing that really helped was a therapist told me to come up with a mantra.
And that was for when I was at work so that when every time I had that urge or thought to drink, I could say this mantra. So I would the first mantra I came up with was that I don't need alcohol to have fun because that was my big concern in the beginning. I thought I would never have fun again. So I said this mantra to myself over and over.
And then it changed to I'm worth more than a bottle of wine every night. And I do feel like making that choice to not drink is such a big act of self love. And you have to like believe that.
your worth it and reading your book. I also listened to on audiobook. It really helped with knowing about the dopamine levels because I used to love to drink wine and work in my garden and
When I stopped drinking, at first, I had no desire to work in my garden. I had very little desire to do anything, and it can be so confusing if you don't know what's going on, but it was so helpful to know that this is normal. Eventually, I will get pleasure from these things again, because I did get pleasure from it before I started drinking, and just knowing that I have trusting that process was really helpful.
Also that knowing that there is nothing wrong with me, that was huge, that it was not me, it was the alcohol, that alcohol is a highly addictive substance. And that was really helpful. And the mantras, I also used naltrexone for a little while. I went to the doctor and got a prescription for naltrexone. And I do remember sitting, I actually bought some vodka.
because this is back when like I didn't have anything in my house and it was very strange working in the wine industry because I had my hands on open bottles of wine all through the day and then when I got home I just made sure I had no alcohol in my house and then it was my place of refuge and I knew once I got home that I was okay
my days off were easier than my days that I worked. So when I had this appointment to see the doctor, I bought some vodka and some orange juice at a cafe and like drink in my car before going into this appointment because I felt like I was just mourning this loss of alcohol. I felt conflicted. I wanted to give it up, but I also loved it so much.
I went into the appointment and he asked about naltrexone. He asked how much I was drinking and I just started crying and he was very compassionate and listened and that it was good that I was coming in to try this. And he also suggested a behavioral specialist at the clinic. So I thought that was nice that he didn't just prescribe the drug. He was like, also have someone to talk to.
the nail tricks on, it was good. You have to have the discipline to use it. It's not like a cure all drug. I didn't really like the way it made me feel. But it helped me in like the first 10 days or those first five days were so hard because of the withdrawals. It just really helped during those time. And I feel like overall it helped because it helped me string together enough sober days.
The more sober days I got, I feel like the closer I got to where I am now where I was about a year and a half of me just trying and failing. Well, not failing, but just falling down and getting back up, falling down and getting back up. And it was really an emotional time.
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I had mixed feelings about AA. I didn't really agree with the whole like I'm powerless. My life is unmanageable because I didn't feel like my life was unmanageable. But I was starting to feel like I was powerless. So I did kind of surrender.
surrendering moment and I was single for all this most of this time and I was on Tinder and went on a Tinder date, met somebody and I had poured some wine into a little jar and drank that on my way to meeting this person and then
in our meeting they ended up telling me that they had been sober for 10 years and he was 40 years old and had been sober all through his 30s which was absolutely mind-blowing to me. I was like that's shocking and I confided in him that I was trying to stop and he just gave me this kind of lecture but it was so good but he was saying you're fighting for your life and people die from it every day you
maybe aren't feeling the effects now, but you're at that age where your body is going to start rebelling. Yeah. Yeah. So I left that date and I cried the entire way home and had one of those, well, I had been going to AA for about 16 days at that point. So I had that moment where I surrendered that I'm powerless and
started going to AA every week. There was a women's meeting. I went every Monday and I did stop drinking for 10 and a half months. So I really don't know if I could have gotten sober without AA in that the community was really great and going every week to a meeting where it just felt like a support group and keeping that focus
Although it had been my focus for a year and a half, I completely delved into all the quit lit. I mean, I was trying everything. So I stopped drinking for 10 and a half months, and it was a absolute miracle because I was still working at the winery. Sometimes I'm like, how did I do that? It's just finally something clicked. And then I was coming up on a
A year and I did still have some struggles at the winery because I felt kind of like I'm selling this lifestyle that it's healthy and it's, and it was organic and you know this high end product and.
sustainably farmed and in Northern California, Mendocino County, this people were coming from all over. I would think about how this was somebody's dream job that I have to work in Anderson Valley, this really beautiful rural area, and wine was a big thing out there. Also, I would follow
some of my colleagues at other wineries and they were like these kind of wine influencers. And even though I knew I didn't want to drink, it's like there was a part of me that was like, God, it's this whole lifestyle. I guess I was romanticizing the lifestyle. And I was coming up on a year and I think I felt like, am I missing out on something? Maybe would I like to drink every once in a while?
So I did have some experiments with it. And at work, I would have like a little very small pour at the end of the day and I started, I was just having this experiment with it. And that's kind of where AA and I parted ways because I did feel like I'm in control of this. I'm not totally powerless. There's nothing.
wrong with me and in AA they wanted me to like start over read the big book again all this and i was just like no i'm not into that um sometimes i i listen to other people's story and they you know had their last drink and never drink again and i that's not my story i definitely experimented with it again but i never had more than a couple of classes i would stop it there and just i guess what came out of that was that it was pretty disappointing actually
And that I like really would build it up in my mind and then have that glass of wine. And it was like, that's not that great. Or I feel like I wanted more to try to get that tipsy feeling. But knowing that it wasn't good for me, I don't know. I just couldn't go back to drinking the way that I used to. And also I was coming up on finally getting out of the wine industry because
In that 10 and a half months when I stopped drinking my heart's not in it anymore, you know, not interested in mine anymore. I wanted to change my career because I didn't believe in the product anymore, but I didn't know what to do. I did have several months in the winter where it was really slow and I had a lot of time to think about.
What to do is how am I going to get myself out of this because I didn't go to college. All my experience was pretty much in the service industry. And I had a lot of insecurities about my life and whether I was smart enough to do anything else. But I feel like I needed that. And I was sober during all that that was in that 10 and a half months.
You know, it was hard, but I had to like really take a hard look at my life and my choices and I had to figure out what I was going to do. So also when I was kind of doing that experimenting, another thing that was going on in my mind was my life was about to change and I was about to finally not be in the industry anymore. So it was kind of just like, this is my last chance to like have a little drink on the job or like have a little alcohol or
It was disappointing, which reaffirmed that it really isn't doing anything for me. If anything, it was, and I've heard this before, but it didn't slow light. Like I really did feel that. It just wasn't adding to my life at all. And it felt really good to know that, to just really confirm that. And so I left the mind industry. I started, I took an entry-level position.
at a hospital in another town. I did move and it's just so much easier now. I don't think about drinking at all. I mean, it's a lot easier now that I don't work with it. So it is definitely nice not working in the industry. Also, I'm dating someone who's been sober for six years and we're both each other's first experience dating sober.
And I love it. It feels definitely like a good healthy relationship. And I love that we don't drink together because that was always something that was entangled in my past relationships, drinking and drinking too much. And I definitely seem to be in the past attracted to people who drink a lot. So yeah, just feel really so happy. I feel, I think the thing I like the most about sobriety is the sense of freedom.
that I don't need a drink to have fun or be social or to relax or just that freedom that I can just be really present with how I'm feeling in that moment and it's okay. So I'm curious, what does working in a wine tasting room entail?
Yeah, so you're giving like wine education about how the wine was made. So it's like a retail thing. You're doing a tasting. So they come in and you're pouring like a little two ounce pour, one ounce to two ounce pour of, there's a lineup and there's description. So they're tasting through.
the different wines and you're talking about sometimes like how it was made or some technical questions, but mostly people are there to just try the wine and buy wine.
I'm just curious because I'm like, wow, that's such a fascinating job to just have it be like you walk in, you cork the wine, you drink the wine in the morning. Yeah. Crazy. Wow. So going back to the beginning, I want to talk about how fascinating it is that when we feel confronted, especially by like someone who actually cares, like a therapist, we're like, okay, I'll just stop going to see you. Was that conscious or how did that work?
I felt like we weren't progressing anymore where we had been done a lot of work, but it just felt like every session became the same where our main objective was, why don't you stop drinking? So every session was kind of the same. And so I was like, oh, this just isn't working for me anymore. Yeah, no, that totally makes sense.
So I wasn't conscious that I was doing it because I didn't want to hear about my drinking, but I think I did maybe consider it and be like, nope, I'm not ready. I'm just not ready for that. Or I don't think that's the problem. Yeah. Yeah. There's so many things that we tell ourselves as we're trying to work it out and figure it out. One of the parts that I really related to you about your story is just like the falling asleep without brushing your teeth. Oh my gosh.
Yes. I think about that often, like, I'll never have to feel that way again that, yeah, I hated that feeling of like wine on my teeth in the morning. And it's so interesting too, because I've had so much dental work. And I've always thought, well, I grew up without any fluoride because, you know, just drinking spring water out of the ground and the cabinet grew up in. But then I'm like, wow, I literally probably
forgot to brush my teeth or was drinking wine because I would have a wine glass by the side of my bed. And I don't remember falling asleep. So I guarantee you, I was not brushing my teeth. And then I've had so many root canals and all this stuff. And I'm like, I bet that had to do with that. Because wine is it's not really sugar, but it's definitely, I'm sure it causes tooth decay, like I'm sure it causes cavities.
Yeah, Andrew Hooverman or Hooverman podcast. He does a podcast on oral hygiene and he talks about drinking and how bad it is for your teeth. Oh my gosh. Yeah, that's so interesting. And never even put that kind of connection together until right this minute. I'm like, oh, yeah, that's terrible. But the other thing that I thought was really interesting about your story is how hangovers would get worse the more of a break you took. And
That is just how the body works, because what happens is your body gets really good at purging alcohol. It makes its method, right? It gets used to it. And then it allows you to drink, and it's taller, and so you don't feel it as much when you're drinking. But then your hangovers aren't as bad, because it's trying to get alcohol out of your system as quickly as possible. It's just like, OK, we're being poisoned.
How can I do everything in my power to like minimize the damage? And so make you as comfortable as possible. Your body is doing all of this stuff for you. And then you give it a break and it's like, Oh, I'm off the hook. I don't have to spend so much time and effort trying to like sustain this barrage of poison. And then all of a sudden you go back to it. And it's like all the defense mechanisms are just down. And all of a sudden you just feel so much worse.
Yeah. And I remember feeling like at that crossroads, like, should I go back to daily drinking where I felt okay or keep going down this path where I have horrible hangovers.
It's really interesting too. I loved the part of your story about experimenting. I think that's so powerful when you were like, okay, I'm just going to try to have a little and just realizing that that wasn't for you. No, it's just not worth it. Was that what you think pushed you over the edge to just committing?
Yeah, where I just don't even think about it now. I mean, at first I had that pink cloud and I was like, I love sobriety. And I've always like, all through that 10 months, I was loving sobriety, but then there was something about like, this is my last chance to see if it's that promise of like, it's going to be relaxing and
It's hard to articulate the fantasy that I had about it, but then it broke the fantasy that it was just disappointing and because really I was.
If I'm going to drink, I want that buzz and to get that buzz. It's just not a healthy amount. And it's going to put me into a cycle that I don't want to be in. It's not worth it for that momentary pleasure that you would maybe get or maybe not.
Even the buzz wouldn't always come sometimes. I would just feel kind of sick to my stomach. So yeah, it just was worth it. I really remember that. I really remember getting back to my hotel room some nights and know it like I had drink for hours and hours and hours knowing that I drink way more than a bottle of wine probably.
closer to two and just getting back to my room and not feeling it. Just kind of feeling not great, but I never felt the buzz. I never felt good. And I was like, it stopped working. It's like not even so disappointing. It's so nice to know that.
The happiness I feel is like a natural happiness, like a natural real happiness. The simple pleasures of brushing my teeth and washing my face before I go to bed that I can count on that now. That it feels really great. And when I hear my friends, because I have friends that still drink and I know like if they're out on a first date and they drink and I'm like, oh, it's kind of too bad that they feel like they need to do that.
or if they're traveling and they're like showing their pictures of their drinks and I'm like oh it's too bad that they feel like they need to drink because they're on vacation or oh yeah I'm just like the freedom of that I don't need that I can yeah just be happy to be on a date or just be happy to be on vacation but that's enough.
It's so true. I remember the first time we went camping and we had gone to the grocery store to get all our food and we were there with a few other couples and we're like, all right, let's go. And then they're like, well, wait, we have to go to the liquor store. And I was like,
Oh, yeah, I forgot that that's what people do. And my husband and I were sitting in the car as they all went to liquor store to buy all their stuff that they're going to drink camping. And I was just sitting there like, yeah, I just felt bad for them. I was like, oh, it just sucks that they still feel like they have to do that. I wish they knew that it's so much more enjoyable otherwise. And I just felt so bad. Like it was so strange. There was no envy, no jealousy. It was just pity. Like I felt pity.
Man, I woke up from some grossness and they're still in it and I am sad for them.
Yeah, socially it is interesting. I've thought about this like how, because I started this new job at the hospital and I tell people I don't drink. And I think that I don't fully know what they're thinking and it doesn't matter. But I feel like there is this assumption that I must have a problem with drinking and that I'm deprived and I've really been like, how do I express how really great this is that I don't?
drink because I can't drink. It's I don't drink because I don't want to and I don't have to. Yeah, not having to drink is the best. And none of us have to drink, but we just don't know it. I think about that a lot. I'm like, I never had to, but I felt like I had to. I was very convinced that I had to like it was so important and to wake up to that and just to know I don't have to drink. It's amazing. It's phenomenal.
Yeah, and I think back to my time of drinking when the kind of false adult, like I just thought that that's what you do when you're an adult and that that was part of being an adult. And now I realize that's like a really false image or idea that I had the false adult, like I was pretending to be an adult, but it's not really what it's about. How about with longer term friends or are you still in touch with people who you used to work with?
So I'm not really in touch with the people I used to work with. I stopped by one day. Everybody was drinking and they were being silly. And I had just come back from running errands kind of a long day, taking care of stuff I was on my way home.
One of them made a comment of like, Oh, you used to be right here with us talking about silly stuff and girl stuff. And I did kind of have that feeling like, Oh, it would be kind of nice to have a drink and like get on their level. But I would, I knew I like, I'll feel worse later. Like I'm just listening to my body. I'm just tired right now. And that's why I'm not all bubbly and happy and giggly. Just taking care of myself. And I knew like, if I
had a drink, like maybe it would help me in that moment, but I would feel worse later. So yeah, I've kind of lost touch with those friends. I seem to be making more friends that don't drink, like just naturally moving towards having friends that don't drink just by like coincidence or I don't know. And then.
Also, I still have my friends to drink. Like my girlfriends from my school were still on a group text and they talk about drinking all the time and it's not a problem. There was a time when it was hard and I was wishing that they would all stop drinking. Like I was like, I wish that everybody would stop drinking. That would work better for me.
Yeah, it doesn't work that way. So that's their choice. Yeah, definitely. It's really interesting to see what sort of friendships stick in what ones fall away.
And to see that you're okay with it, to be like, Oh, yeah, no, this is, this is still so much better. Like I'm still so okay with this compared to, you know, what life used to be like. And even if it does look different, like just to feel super okay with it, I think is, is really powerful. Any other aspects of your story you want to share?
Yeah, I'm just so grateful for your book and your information that you put out the podcast and all the Quitlet book out there, all the support that's out there. And I'm just so glad that I never gave up trying. And actually, I kind of gave up trying it a couple times where I'd be like, oh, I give up. As long as I'm working in the tasting room, I give up. I can't taste too hard.
But then I'd feel bad enough or that little voice was always there. And so then I'd try again, just kept trying. And eventually, I would say that to listeners to keep trying and also that is something that that guy had said on that date, he would say, like, your life will be better than you could ever imagine. And that really stuck with me. And it's true. My life, it really is better than I could have ever imagined without alcohol.
It's amazing how things can change and shift in ways you did not even expect. And you're like, wow, this was such a big thing in my life. I always think like this fermented liquid in a glass became such a big thing and such an all consuming thing. And it can feel so.
How did that happen? But I mean, I do understand how, but it's still hard to conceptualize how much of our lives we can give. There's a quote I think you might be like Henry David Thoreau or something, but he says, the price of anything is how much life you give an exchange for it. And I was like, oh my gosh, like that makes alcohol the most expensive thing on the planet because I have how much life.
how many memories, how many moments, how much the joy and the small pleasures. I really also really love how you just talk about keeping trying and even seeing the dopamine for little things like gardening. It does come back. It just takes a lot of time and sometimes not as much time, but you just have to give your body a chance to get back to balance, get back to homeostasis to try to
do its job for you in a way where it's not being sabotaged at every turn by the alcohol you're pouring down your throat. And then eventually, yeah, things really do get to be better than you can have imagined. And you're like, why didn't I do this before? But of course, I think it's so, so valid and so important to just be like, look, we're all just on our own journey. Like it's twists and it's turns. It's not linear. It's because in all sorts of different directions, sometimes it gets much worse before it gets better.
Well, let me ask you the question that I ask at the end of these, which is if you were going to go back in time and talk to Jana about what life is like now for her, which I guess you've kind of done already, but is there anything particular you would say? Yeah, I kind of already said it, but I love this question and I do think about it and I do think about how hard it was and I would tell myself, just don't give up, just keep trying. It doesn't matter how many times you fall down. It doesn't matter. Let it go. Just get up and
try again and try to imagine how good it can be. I don't know. And have that faith. Yeah, I love that. Almost like being just open to possibilities. Could it be better than this? Yes, exactly. Thank you. Yeah. Well, that's so great. Well, thank you so much for coming on and sharing your story. I've really enjoyed getting to know you a bit and it's just been awesome. I really appreciate it. Thank you. I know people do. The stories are so powerful. How a great day.
Yes, you too. Thank you so much for listening to this episode. If you're ready to see how this naked mind can help you on your personal health and wellness journey and want to learn more, go to this nakedmindpodcast.com to learn what your next best step is. Again, that's this nakedmindpodcast.com. We have all of our free resources, programs, social links, and more available for you there.
Plus, if you have your own naked life story to share, you can submit it there as well. Until next week, stay curious.
