Perimenopausal-Brain Toolkit: Moving, Raging & Getting with Besties - Dr. Mariza Snyder

on this episode of the Resetter podcast. I bring you my new favorite friend, Dr. Marisa Snyder, and you're gonna hear why I'm introducing her as my new favorite friend, and why that matters, because we're about to dive into

The mental health challenges that so many of us go through specifically in the perimenopausal years, but we of course talk about postmenopausal years as well. So before I go into what you're going to learn and what the conversation's about, let me tell you a little bit about Dr. Marisa because this woman's energy, her mind, her heart is just, it's just incredible. So she's a functional practitioner, a woman's hormone expert, and she has authored

eight books. That is not easy. I can tell you as an author, that is not easy. And her newest book, The Essential Oils Menopause Solution, is a must, by the way. I have it, I've used it, and it really helps understand how to blend different oils for different symptoms. And she is embarking upon another book that will come out at the end of 2025 on the Perry menopausal years.

and the mental health chain challenges that we face. So think of the conversation you're about to hear as two girlfriends talking about what they experienced in their perimenopausal journey. I think you're going to see and hear a lot of the symptoms that you have are hormonal symptoms.

And so Dr. Marisa and I talk about like, how do you know? I mean, think about this. Like, how do you know that depression is a hormonal issue or that depression is just because your life needs some change? How do you know that are you just irritable or is your husband chewing really loud really annoying to you?

These are the kind of things that we talk about like how did we navigate this dramatic brain change that happens during the perimenopausal years what how did we recognize it and how did we navigate it. So it's a really fun conversation as much as that didn't sound fun. I think.

A lot of you will find yourself in this conversation. You will see that the brain changes that are happening to you are normal. And at the end, we talk about some of the best ways to meet these mental changes head on. And they are

fun ways and free ways. So it's a really cool conversation. Dr. Marisa is now a Hay House author like me. So we have bonded over there. I call her my Hay House soul sister because she is writing menopause books with me and health books with me under the same publisher. And I have found a kindred spirit in this beautiful woman. And I think that you are going to find some real nuggets of sanity.

in this conversation. So I hope it puts a smile on your face and that as always, the time you spend with me and my podcast moves your mind, your life, and your health forward. So I'm sending you, please know, especially before this, we launch into this conversation how much

I care about your well-being and I hope that you find something here that really frees you because the Perry menopausal years can be tough and I want you to see that it's all temporary and there are solutions

that could be right around the corner from you. So hope it helps. Welcome to the Resetter Podcast. This podcast is all about empowering you to believe in yourself again. If you have a passion for learning, if you're looking to be in control of your health and take your power back, this is the podcast for you.

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So, you know, I always like welcome people to the podcast because I feel like it's welcoming people into my home. But I actually think what we're about to do is welcome people into our voice text. Yes, our memos. I just so welcome. Yeah, I am so happy that you're here and I can't wait to dive into this topic. So thank you for being here.

I'm here. I can't wait. So here's where I want to go with this conversation. But before we do that, I want you to go into a little bit of a background on you and like how you got so your mind so heavily wrapped into hormones, which I think happens to all of us when we hit rocky places.

But can you just so people can we can fill in like the gaps of like how did you end up at this point of your life really dialed in on hormones and how is it personal to you? It is so deeply personal for almost all of my life.

But especially, I'll pick, when at what point in time are you looking for Mindy, I'll pick the point where it really felt like a point of no return. I was 30 years old, my mom was actually 48, so do the math, she was 18 when she had me, and she was going through...

Serious, scary, what I call kind of a nightmare of symptoms in perimenopause. And I myself, kind of looking forward, I was also struggling with what I thought was like, ooh, are these precursors to what is to come? So I was dealing with major deregulated cortisol, estrogen dominance. So the symptoms were painful, heavy periods, bloating, migraines. But ultimately, I had a hard time just getting myself out of bed in the morning.

And it was in this time where not only was I kind of helping my mom or at least understanding what she was going through, but also all of the women in my practice were in perimenopause. They were in midlife. And they were being siloed into statins and metformin and sleep medications and anti-anxiety, SSRIs, all the things. And I was like, there's something greater at play here versus siloing women. I call it like the perimenopause starter pack.

where we're just putting women on all these medications for all these different things. And I was like, there's something, there's a bigger root cause here, and it's shifting hormones. And for some of us, we can see, you know, hormones going out of balance due to lifestyle or trauma or stress. And so for me, I had been running like a freight train until I, it was a, I ignored all the whispers, I ignored all the like, hey, hey. And then I just got sick too.

Yep. Yep. It's such a good comment. Go ahead. Keep going. But yes, the whispers turned into screams. Oh, for sure. For sure. Turned into, I can't get out of bed. And I was like, oh, what have I done? What have I done? And it's always that too. I think a lot of us, we really do blame ourselves. It's like, oh gosh, what have I done to me? How old were you? I was 30.

Oh wow, so early early. I was like, oh goodness. And I knew, I knew that whatever I did movie, I was at a crossroad. I could go one way or I could go another. And I knew that the way that I had been living my life, I was borrowing against myself for so long. I used to think stress, activating that stress response system was a superpower. I used to think that that was a slight edge. I'm like, oh, I will beat somebody else out because I'm gonna leverage against myself. I didn't know that's what I was doing.

And eventually I couldn't get up in the morning. I had no cortisol awakening response. Basically, I basically just tanked. And I remember going to a hormone doctor because, you know, you should always go to somebody else. And they ran my labs and it was just, it was a hot mess city. It was just, oh, but all I was recommended was Zoloft and get on hormonal birth control again.

And I thought, man, we have got to do better, especially when I think about that is often the standard of care for women in the perimenopausal transition. So what my mom was being offered at 48 was what I was being offered at 30.

And I was like, yeah, because we only had, back then we only had like five things to offer. This was 2010. Anti-dep, yeah, anti-depressants and a handful of other things. So, Ambien, do they give you any answers, please? No, no, I was obviously,

Over over tired like I was sleeping deep into the morning. So I was my being able to get awake. Obviously, you know, never looking at like mitochondria never actually addressing that was the thing that that was going to fix my hormones that was going to regulate my hormones. I'm like, I'm pretty sure you can't regulate hormones with endocrine disruptors that just shut the whole system down.

And I thought to myself, I am one of millions who literally have walked in these doors and walked right back out with no viable solution. And I knew hormonal birth control wasn't going to fix my cortisol issue. It wasn't going to fix my growing insulin resistance. It wasn't going to fix the way that I operated in life.

It wasn't going to fix that either. And so that's when I was like, okay, I know I'm here to be a part of this solution. If my entire practice is me, just older, and I know that there's other women just like me at this age too, or even younger, that there's got to be a better way. And we've got to have a much more integrative approach, a loving approach to taking care of women.

You know what I'm thinking? An interesting question to ask a doctor who is helping you through menopause is what their menopause experience was. Because I hear this, I sit here with so many doctors that are, you know, wimp female that are like, you know what, I hit a wall and then I created my own solution and then I went and taught the solution.

And I think it's, you know, we have so many women that listen to this podcast that are trying to figure out how to navigate the perimenopausal years. And I'm starting to think literally the first question you should ask yourself or ask your doctor is what was your experience? I agree. And how did you navigate? Don't you think? Yeah. And how did you navigate it? With an IUD and some antidepressants and, you know, just, just, you know, clog your way through that moment. You know, how is it? Because is that going to be your, my recommendations? You know,

That's right. How did you navigate that journey? I mean, I think I told you this. Again, people are getting a glimmer of what you and I voice message back and forth, but I just went and saw Dr. Felice Gersch. And when she sat down with me, she spent two and a half hours going through my whole medical history, which was really nothing.

And then there were some root cause stuff. She's like, I had a traumatic near death experience in my 30s. And she's like, have you gotten trauma work on that? I'm like, oh my God, what doctor asks you that, which was so amazing. But then we got to this point where she's like, I want to turn you into a super-ager. And I was like, what's a super-ager? And we go down this whole thing. Well, she's 72 years old.

And she looks great. She's still like functioning really well. And I all of a sudden found a wise elder. And I was like, look at this woman has had her own menopausal journey that is inspiring to me. And she wants to collaborate with me and work with me, not shame me and give me antidepressants. So I just want to point that out because I think it's really important that we understand the person delivering the message.

Oh, absolutely. And if they're hearing our goals, what are their goals? How are they framing our journey in their mindset? Yes. But then also, how are they collaborating with us in terms of who we want to become? How resilient we want to be in this journey?

And so, yeah, someone who will walk with you and someone who is open to you questioning and kind of a very interactive conversation and being open to bigger resources and asking other people in case something comes up that they're not 100% clear on, like someone who's willing to go the journey with you.

Yeah. Yeah, which brings me to the next part of my perimenopausal journey and something you're really talking about and experience yourself. And I'm so happy you're talking about it. So thank you. It's the mental health changes that we're seeing with women. I always, my audience knows if they listen to me. I'm almost 55. I'm postmenopausal, but somewhere in my mid 40s, it was like somebody took my brain, took it out of my skull, and then put another brain in there and said, okay, try to use this one.

And I found myself irritable, easily agitated, yelling at my children. I've never yelled at my kids like that before. Everything was annoying me, including my own thoughts. And it shocked me. So can you talk? I know you had a very similar experience, but can you talk about

What you've saw, I know you've had some other additional brain stressors, but in what you're seeing with women, just so women can feel heard and seen and understand that they are not alone and really give context to these mental changes that women are experiencing. Absolutely. I think I want to start off with any woman who's in the

four to 10 plus year transition, that is perimenopause, where we are in a profound brain reorganization, that you are definitely not alone. That eight out of the 10 symptoms of perimenopause are brain related, and most of those are mood related. I think a lot of people think that the number one symptom of perimenopause is stubborn weight gain. And yes, that's often why women are hot flashes. Or hot flashes or poor sleep, but no, it is irritability.

It is, it is the way your partner is breathing and eating. Yep. Everything.

Yes, I remember this one time it was during the pandemic that I literally was lying in bed and I could, I swore I could hear my teenage son chewing in the kitchen downstairs. I came down and I was like, who's chewing so loud? And everybody looked at me like I was a freak. And I'm like, you have to stop. You have to close the doors. You're chewing way too loud. And then I went upstairs. I was like, who am I? What is going on here? So you're absolutely right. Irritability, yet we don't talk about that.

No, no, because it can feel like the daily pain points. You know, so often women, it could be brushed off or brushed under the rug of like, oh, I don't have the level of resilience. I think one of the things that I have experienced and other women I know in this transition, because I'm going to be 45, literally in a couple of days, is things that were effortless. I didn't have to think about, like put a blindfold over my eyes, put my hands behind my back, like I could do it all day, any day. And then all of a sudden,

that requires effort. The level of multitasking that I was able to effortlessly do requires more consideration and thought, more planning. And there's something about, you're like, oh my gosh, again, took out the productive, efficient

mega mom brain and then replace it with this perimenopause brain and you're like, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. Like I'm still, my obligations are still require this level of capacity, but now my brain is operating at this level of this lower level of capacity. And that can be very disalarming because we are helping.

Yeah, help us understand that. Why is that? Because I feel like if you understand something and you make sense of it, then it actually feels a little bit calmer, at least to my brain. I'm always trying to make sense of everything. So I know you had Dr. Moscone on the show not too long ago, and I'm sure she talked about that women undergo three major brain reorganizations. The first one is puberty.

Right and I mean what a what a wild ride puberty was for all of us especially our parents right and if that is like a good eight-year transition where we come online into our reproductive years around 20 years old right the brain is still vastly developing but we prune back gray matter shifts we prune back I think it's like 40 plus percent of our neurons

It's a huge amount. So you're trying to navigate life and maybe boyfriends and classes and your brain is literally being rebuilt. And so no wonder Pariamena Paz can feel so challenging. The next one is pregnancy and postpartum. And any mom listening, you know that once you become a mom, there's no going back. You will never be... You never know where your keys are again.

That and like our protector energy are, you know, are knowing where children are at all times, you know, picking, you could pick out your baby out of a line of a 50 babies. I mean, it is impressive. The amount, I mean, you're just all systems focused on protecting that child. But constantly, I did a major check-in with my nanny and Alex. Like, you should see the little checklist I'm running off for my little three-year-old.

postpartum. And then again, hormones are kind of menopausal range in postpartum as well. So major brain reorganization, hormones, tanking, no wonder we see so much depression and anxiety and overwhelm, put in sleep or lack thereof. And here we go. Then, and the third one is perimenopause.

That is, and I think, you know, in a lot of ways, it's a higher stakes transformation because I feel like there's more, I'm not having a baby is pretty high stakes too. You're keeping that baby alive. It's pretty important. But very menopause, you've got, you mostly have family, you've got partners, you've got parents. I have a sick sister who, you know, I'm always getting involved in.

She had a stroke last year and she had a major spine surgery this year. And so I'm always involved in her. So I always say, you know, often that sick parents, it's a sick sister. And so there's just a lot more life circumstances that are happening. And we know that our gray matter declines.

We trim back those neurons again, even white matter. But then with estradiol and progesterone dropping, progesterone is a powerful anti-inflammatory as alopregnan alone. And then estradiol has receptor sites to dopamine, serotonin, talking about motivating hormones, progesterone stimulates GABA. You want to stop that irritation? You need more of that. You want to get some sleep?

And so these hormones start to shift and now what our dear friend Dr. Kerry Jones calls it, unconscious uncoupling, but particularly in the receptor sites of your brain. And so your brain at times can be in a bit of an inflammatory state due to an uncoupling of these receptor sites at inconsistent times. So that's what's happening in the brain. We also see a decline in glucose metabolism.

Yeah. Yeah. Well, and, and, uh, Dr. Moscone and I talked about that because I was like, I, I see so many menopausal women that once they learn how to fast and they get some ketones in, they get their brain clarity back. And I was like, do we have research on menopausal women and ketones? And she goes, no, I was like, can you.

Do get on that, please? Yes, there isn't a lot of research on menopause brain or perimenopause brain. What little we know, this is what little we know. It's a little bit more than what I just shared, but including the estrogen, sorry, the, not only, you know, kind of.

The binding of estrogen, how critical that is to glucose metabolism. But yeah, that lack of metabolic flexibility and how critical that becomes to the brain in menopause. I mean, that's why I love your work because that's how we shift. If the way that our brain receives energy shifts and we become more resistant to that glucose energy, well, then we better find another energy source.

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walk through and you can do it from a personal lens because again, I just want to point out that you're not only talking from an expert hormone slant, but you're talking from a perimenopausal slant. Walk through the symptoms because I can tell you when I was going through perimenopause, there were a few symptoms that shocked me. Probably the biggest one is that I couldn't do the same amount of work that I used to do in a day. I would say that symptom is actually still around.

Like I used to be, you give me a 10 to 12 hour work day and I would pump that out with a smile on my face. Now I'm like five hours. I'm like, I'm done. I've had enough. So let's just walk through some of the major brain symptoms so that people can really understand that it's not their fault. Not their fault. That it is, menopause. It is, yeah. So the kind of the first brain symptoms that you'll notice, I'd like to just walk you through that timeline.

Yeah, early 40s, maybe even late 30s, but I would say early 40s. I know for me, I feel like I fell off a cliff at 43. I was like, yeah, me too. 43 was a big year. What happened? Yeah, you're like, yeah, what just happened to me? Yeah, a shuck. Exactly. It was, yeah.

Yeah, I was, I would say it was like at 40, I came into my 40s, like in the best health of my life, by 43, I was on the couch crying. Yeah, no, that was very much. I went from postpartum, I had a baby at 41, I was cruising after those first nine months, a little rough, and then I was doing so great. I remember heading into 23, barely 43, and I just fell off a cliff, and I was like, and initially you're like, what is, what's happening? I went down all the rabbit holes. I'm like, what, what is this? And I was, oh, it's very, it's very menophiles.

So those initial symptoms will feel like, again, irritability, especially in, towards your period. So all of a sudden, PMS symptoms are a little bit heightened. You may even feel what I've noticed is a lack of stress resilience. So things that you had major capacity for, you don't have that capacity. These longer workdays where you're juggling all the things, you work your eight-hour shift and then you go into mom mode for another five hours, you realize you don't have it in the tank.

You know someone's asking you some very cerebral questions, and you're like my brain stopped working at five o'clock if I made it to that point So you'll notice you know again brain fog not in an ability like how women describe it is I'm not as productive Because that it's always a languaging around like how how am I showing up? So I'm not as productive

I'm not able to do as much as I used to be able to do. I find myself not having as much patience or understanding or compassion for a lot of circumstances. My sleep is beginning. I'm having a harder time going to sleep. I feel wired and tired at night before bed. And I may be even waking up at night in the middle of the night. And then the other thing that may be even more so, for me, it's not even just irritability. It's anger and rage.

So there'll be a couple. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. That shocked me. Scared me. Oh, yeah. I remember where I felt like there was this, like a demon trying to get out of my body. It just, it was like a fire inside of my system that was looking to get unleashed. And I'm still trying to gentle parent to my three year old.

At the same time. So the rage and the anger was very scary for me. And then the lack of word recall. I'd be in a conversation with you where I would be in an interview where I would just be talking to a bestie and all of a sudden that word just fluttered away. And it was never coming back. It was never coming back. So the lack of word recall, lack of concentration and also alertness. So those are kind of those early symptoms. And again, they can look like maybe I didn't get enough sleep last night.

You know, they're sneaking. This is why I want to unpack this because I see it now looking back. But when I was in it, what everything you just said looked like. This is what my brain said. I'm burnout. I don't want to keep doing like, you know, my job anymore. I, my husband is annoying me. Like, why is he not?

like treating me the same way he was before. Like, I'm done being a mom. These kids aren't like in teenage years. Like, what the heck is going on? You're testing me. Yeah, I couldn't pick up a book and just read a novel. I'm finally starting to be able to read a novel now for the first time. I couldn't focus on that. I kept forgetting my task list all over the place.

it literally felt like somebody had given me like two legs and said, okay, two left legs. And we're like, here you go, try to walk. Like every day I felt like I was tripping all over myself. So, and stress resilience is another one. Like as a human that I could take, I had so much, and I still have a ton of grit, but I was like you, I was like, just, I could put my head down and do anything. And I no longer wanted to do that.

So, you know, how do we help a woman understand? I could have easily said, my kids who I love, by the way, are 24 and 22 and are amazing humans. I just so proud. My momma heart is so proud. But I could have said, oh, I messed up as a parent. I could have divorced my husband, which I didn't either. I could have made a like totally quit my job, which I didn't. Like there's so many things that

appeared as external problems, but were actually my internal ability to interpret those problems had changed. And how do we know the difference between hubby? I need to leave you and hubby. My brain has now taken on a new level of stress. Oh, that is a gosh. Well, because it's a yes and.

Yes, you know, partners need to understand. Yes, partners need full on communication. And yes, you know, I am calibrating. Is this a situation where in my relationship, there are things that are not.

that are major fissures in our relationship, in our marriage or partnership? Or is this just me really struggling? I think whether that's a couple's therapy or vulnerability or maybe trauma work that helps you kind of sift through that, I will say that the fiest number of divorce is in this time.

Yeah. I know. And 70% of them are initiated by women. And so I can tell you that I really learned to talk differently, tell my husband, like, oh my god, this is what's going on with me. And it's like we had to sort of, and we still are, he's having to get to know the new version of me.

And the Perry menopausal version was not the version of the woman he married, and the post-menopausal version is definitely a new version. But it's taken a lot of explanation and a lot of helping him see that this is, as my brain changes, so is the way I show up for you. I don't know if you and your husband have had that same kind of communication. Obviously, he's been a hormone expert for a long time.

Yeah, right. By proxy. He's my COO, so he's very much in it. I'm talking to women at an event, and I'm taken up. He's still asking him questions. Like, well, we can't get to your wife, but let's ask you. Oh, my gosh. Oh, my gosh. That's so great. That's so good. One of the things that I think, especially if someone's in perimenopause listening, particularly what you'll notice, what I notice after, whether I ovulate or not, some months I don't, I'm very much, my cycle runs 26 days.

You know, until it's not. I don't know, you know, who knows? What day? What cycle? It's not going to be 26 days anymore in perimenopause. But I will have the first day that I'll notice a shift in my resilience, in my mental and emotional well-being, is it'll feel like a little bit of anxiousness. It'll feel like a little bit of stress. A little bit of life is a tiny bit insurmountable. Now two days ago,

Life, same problem, same issue, same stuff. My brain just is reorganizing it differently. I'll just notice I'm a little bit more nitpicky. I'm a little bit more irritated. And Alex will be like, huh, you know, what's going on here? And then the next day, it'll be so obvious.

It'll it'll it'll it'll send up like it basically ratchets up like all of a sudden I'm super irritated I'm more angry and then we're like oh We know what's happening. So I would I'll announce especially if I'm feeling a little bit of irritation or a little bit of overwhelm I'll say hey, I'm noticing that I'm feeling a bit more overwhelmed and my schedule I didn't stack it and

to support me as well as I would love. And we have a three-year-old, so I'm like, is there any way in the next couple of days that you could take over all of nighttime routine? That you could carry the, could you take on this responsibility? Could you hold this for me? And so we start to reorganize the things that I'm not locked into that have flexibility.

And so Alex will be like, OK, because he does. He has a lot more bandwidth than I do in these moments. And either way, every single night for two and a half hours, we're in a nighttime routine with a three-year-old. And so that's what we'll all notice. Initially, again, it'll just feel like, oh, maybe my day was too busy that day or I was a little bit overbooked. And then the next day, I tip the scale. And so I think it's really monitoring those symptoms and then full-on communication.

I like what you said because I would track this as well, that where I was happy last week, and now I'm not happy, that happens a lot through the whole Perry menopausal journey. You're going along and you're like, everything's great. And then three days later, you're like, life is horrible.

I've actually seen some interesting research that they say that the part of the brain that gives you suicidal ideation actually gets stimulated when you're going through menopause. You start like sort of dreaming about taking yourself out, which sounds horrible, but it is part of the brain, what I call the brain remodel project. Like the brain is remodeling itself and changing itself. And so we do have some of these centers that pop up.

But the difference between life is horrible and I want out or my brain is remodeling is what you said. Three weeks ago, I was fine. And now this week, I'm not fine. Yeah. And it's a yes. And I think that it's so important to have that awareness and to have, I mean, it's easier said than done to say have extra grace.

and have beautiful, and I have so many strategies and tools that I pull out of my toolbox. And here's the thing, sometimes in my luteal phase, that second part of the cycle, it starts earlier. I'm like, oh, I'm just two days into this. This isn't supposed to happen.

I'm deserved another four days of peace. Did my progesterone not even show up to the party? And then other times, I can make it all the way to day 24. And I'm good. And so every single month, it's gonna be a different ride. And I think it's just really listening and honoring. And when, for the most part, I really do my best to buffer myself as best as I can.

Because I feel like I deserve it. I deserve safety. I deserve extra grace. Even when life feels, again, insurmountable. It didn't, three days ago, but all of a sudden it feels so heavy. And like, I'm going to barely crawl through it. I'm like, okay, how do I support myself in this moment, this phase that I know is temporary? You know, even in these next couple of days, how do I resource myself so that I'm honoring my body and I'm honoring the process?

Yeah. Okay, talk about some of the toolbox tools that you use because some of them you and I have talked about that are just phenomenal and they're free to everybody and I want people to know them. But what I'm hoping is that as people are hearing themselves in this conversation and understanding that their mind is not, they're not going crazy. I also am hoping that we can really come together, put our brains together to be able to help women figure out like, what do you do in that moment?

So you've hit that moment where his breathing is driving you crazy. The looping thoughts, you can't stop, and you're just not sure where do you go with your own head. So give me some ideas of what women do.

Yeah, absolutely. So I think that first step in those moments, right, is awareness. Pain attention to your physiology. So it's not so much my thoughts as much as it's my physiology. And it also could be, again, it could be trauma here.

You know, that there's a pattern that you're, you're, you're up regulating. And so I get more, more tense. I get more charged focus. I'm not chilling, like laying back, like I'm in, I'm in like handled business energy. I might jaw tenses. Everything just gets tighter. And so when I start to notice those physiological changes, that is the time where if I have bandwidth, like I have a moment, I will go and step outside. I'll take up even a three minute walk in nature.

I will, I'll try to shake it off because I know that's often charged cortisol too, like adrenaline. That's running through me. That's firing without thinking. And so I'll shake it off. I'll dance or swamp. So I love rage dancing. So if I can get up into my bedroom, I'll do a five minute rage dance where I'll just move. What's a rage dance? It's usually some kind of really intense music.

Like screaming, but like death metal. I do not love death metal. I would say like a song that, you know, maybe it's a very sad song or maybe it's like a higher energy, like maybe Alanis Morcette, you know, something like that, you know, we're just, you know, you're just, and I usually grab a pillow and I just start moving my body and just shaking the energy.

I'll do I'll kind of kind of swamp and this is Mama Gina's work where I'll just try to alchemize that energy. And then if I've got bandwidth, I'll move into like a Saturday song, like maybe Sarah McLaughlin or something like that or Lauren Hill. And all of a sudden, all the emotions are moving and mobilizing and I'll find myself crying. You know, like again, and I will feel so much better that I've just kind of uncharged a lot of those emotions. Another thing that I'll do is I scream into pillows a lot.

Oh yeah, okay. I never screamed in a pillow. I feel like just screaming in the house. It feels so good. But that's good. I'm going to think about the pillow. It might be the neighbors. Whether it's in a car, especially if you're like, even if people are in the house and you're afraid they're going to hear you, you can have a pillow. I have a pillow in the trunk. So I'm just ready. Okay. I'll scream in the pillow.

You kind of said three things, though, that I think are really interesting. Walking became my absolute go-to menopausal medicine. If I could not walk, I probably would have killed myself. I can't tell you how many times I'm like, I don't know what to do with my thoughts, and I've literally put my tennis shoes on, and I just walk.

And we have so much of a better understanding that bilateral stimulation, right, left, right, left. And when you look out at the horizon, that brings cortisol down. I've even now added, you've got to try this. I've added in a weighted vest. I've become one of the Rutgers.

But a weighted vest calms the nervous system down, and I go walk, and it's become my drug of choice. It can literally turn my mood in a second. I love that. The second thing you said was trauma release therapy. What is that? Because animals do that when they're under trauma, they shiver it out. You're just spelling that excess cordilence. It's got to go somewhere.

Yeah. You know, meditation ain't going to get it done. You know, no, you can't sit down and meditate in that moment. No, no. And then music, I, me and music have become besties through this Perry menopausal journey. And my kids actually said to me, why do you listen to such sad music?

And I think I'd like to listen to sad music so I can just sometimes sit and go into the sadness of it because it's like, I don't know what to do with all this mind energy and maybe this feeling the sadness actually helps me move through it. So I'm right with you on those strategies.

Some other things I've done, especially in this time, there's these beautiful women. They're so incredible. They hold amazing space, and they do this two-hour transformational breath work. And everyone's screaming. Everyone's screaming and, oh, yeah, yeah, we talk in. Oh, that's great. It's mostly 80 plus percent women. It's like 20 people can be in this room, this living room. It's in the living room.

And I usually go twice a month and I am just moving it out and they'll do energy work while you're doing it. I mean, if you're not crying, it's a guarantee cry moment. You know, you're going to cry at some point in this two-hour breath work. So I'm heading there next Friday. So that's been helpful. Also, somatic. Like you said, more of those somatic kind of in your body. So I have a weighted scarf.

that I'll put around my neck that will just calm my system, kind of like the weighted vest that you were talking about. Breath even for me, like a 30 second, one minute kind of breath work exercise, whether it's the kind of the longer exhale versus the inhale, I think it's a four, seven, eight breath that I'll do, but also run through the holotrophic breath, where it's the really more intense breath to move it through, because I'm just trying to move energy out.

I'm also really down to just honor, own my emotion. I'm feeling irritated. I'm feeling mad. I'm feeling angry. I'm feeling rageful. And then asking myself, like, well, where is that in my body? Where is that coming from? Is it my stomach? Is it my heart? Is it my throat? And so getting more in tune with my body and really understanding where I'm holding on to those emotions.

Because I have an ACEs score of a seven, a childhood event score of a seven, I knew that trauma was going to play out in a lot of different ways, potentially. And I feel like I wouldn't say that it's made my perimenopause easier.

And so I really honor that too. It's like, there's this trauma that I'm working through. So I do a lot of parts work. I do EMDR. So I go work with, yeah, I work with a trauma-informed therapist. And so even though I do a lot of the free tools and I'm very consistent, I walk sometimes four times a day.

Because I just need to be out solo, just being outside, moving my body, maybe listening to something, maybe not, and having really scheduled a long time more than anything, just giving myself space and bandwidth. And then the other thing that I really rely on are my best friends.

You know, who can hold space and capacity for my really big, intense emotions. Sometimes I feel like my partner, because he's in it, can't always do that for me. It doesn't have as much compassion as my besties do. That's been huge for me. I just, I will voice memo. I mean, like, it all comes out. And I can just send it off. And I just feel so much better.

Let's go back to the trauma, and then we're going to the friends, because I have a lot of thought on the friends. Do you think that trauma, since you know that you had a traumatic childhood, do you feel like you can handle traumas when you're locked and loaded with all the right hormones and neurochemicals, but once they go away, those traumas, if they're left unhealed,

They're coming out and they're all coming out. And all of a sudden now you are sitting in a life of trauma that needs to be addressed. Yeah, I mean, we can only hide from it for so long. And I feel like pairing menopause, whether it's the universe, I don't know, I call it the reckoning and the biggest time of review. Because all of a sudden, whatever you are able to kind of like shove back, kind of just cover it up with more productivity.

Covered up with more accomplishments, achievement, perfectionism, all those things that look good on paper when we lose that capacity and these hormones begin to decline, it's like we're facing ourselves for the first time for some of us. That's it, that's it. I just had Terry Cole on here and we were talking about her new book, a high functioning codependent and I was saying that I'm going through just a journey of really facing myself for the first time.

And I know that it's because of two things. It's because these hormones have shifted and the other things have shifted. And now my parenting, it looks very different. Your parenting will look different as well because you have a little guy right now, but my kids don't need me. I closed my clinic. My clinic doesn't need me. So my patients aren't there. I just noticed that my identity changed.

And that loss of identity left me alone with me. And when I got alone with me, wow, that got really interesting. And thank God I have an incredible EMDR specialist who has worked with me.

When I hear you say that, I just want every woman to hear that there's this possibility as you go through perimenopause, where traumas you couldn't deal, you were able to push down before, you cannot push down anymore. And it's not your fault, it's just you don't have the neurochemical bandwidth to be able to do that.

Is there anything we can say to those women? I mean, how do we help them? Absolutely. I want to see it. I'm trying to reframe as that this is a gift that I get to face myself, that I get to redefine and I am, that I get to discover these patterns that have been driving me for so long, these little adaptations that my little Marisa self, whether she was seven or 12 or 15, she just made up because she didn't have a choice at the time. And then she thought she could just carry them on through.

And they're not serving anymore. And who I'm becoming, I get to honor her and I get to honor the adaptations and the things that have made me me. But I also get to decide, is this what I want to bring into my next phase? Is this what's going to up level me into the kind of woman I want to be? Who I want to show up as? And I don't want to effort my way through life anymore. I'm exhausted.

Yeah, me too. I'm exhausted too, and this is the thing. I feel like we're all exhausted, and then we come roaring into perimenopause, exhausted, and then all our neurochemicals change, and all of a sudden our brain and our body's like, here you go, deal with your traumas, learn how to communicate differently to your spouse,

And it's just a lot to handle, which leads me to my next point, and one that you and I really bond on, which is my friendships, my girlfriend friendships, used to be fun and exciting before, and now they are like medicine for me.

But yeah, so how do we, this is one thing that I really feel like you and I are hearts align on, which is how do we surround all women in this experience? And as a history, women are mean to women. Like we're not nice to each other.

And I feel like menopause is the time to change that because any woman that's going through a hormonal transition deserves a hug. I've even stood and spoke at conferences in front of thousands of people. And I ask all the Perry menopausal women to raise their hand. And then I tell everybody, look at those women and at the break, go give them a hug.

Because this is a time where we need to come together as a collective and support each other, not and lean into each other, not tear each other apart. 100%. I will always say, I take care of everybody by taking care of women.

I have been a champion of women since I can, since I was so young, I don't even remember. And so I've been really blessed to always have beautiful, amazing women around me. But even in this stage, very specifically in this stage, the caliber of deep connections is so much more than it's ever been. And again, I think it all comes down to, especially in the menopausal experience, is feeling safe and feeling belonging.

That's what matters. Safety is huge. Yeah, safety is oxytocin. Yes. Ooh. And belonging. They're both oxytocin. Yeah, and they trump cortisol. So, you know, they totally... Oxytocin is the only hormone you can just shut cortisol down. She is the queen, she really is the clean hormone right there.

She is. Especially when we're going through it and it could feel like our world is getting smaller, that's really the opportunity to step out. It may feel a little bit scary, especially if your experience has been, man, I've had a lot of mean girls or women, it's more surface level. If that's been the case for you, I just want to invite you to take that first step.

Maybe it was somebody that used to be best friends with while you were moms or someone that you went to yoga with all the time and then, you know, things like the pandemic kid and people moved and there was a mass of reshuffling. I think women felt more alone in that time than ever before and many of us may not have recovered from, you know, that loss of friendship and connection as well. And so I say go back and reach out. I send memos to friends who I haven't talked to in a while, at least once a week.

And even if I don't hear anything back, I was memoing a friend of mine about a month, two months ago, and I didn't hear back, and I memoed again, I didn't hear back, and then I got a message from her husband, and she has been diagnosed with Lewy Body Dementia.

is one of my best friends and you know it's one of those friends where no matter where you are in life like no matter how long it's been you just come right back together and I didn't at the time where I was sending these memos like every month or so and I didn't hear back I didn't think anything of it but then come to find out that she was really leaning on those at a very very hard and difficult time and I'm still sending them almost every single week and so like you just never know when you take that step

the impact that's going to have on somebody else's life. We just don't know where everyone is at. And so my recommendation is take that step, like go through your Rolodex, go through your phone, go through Instagram or Facebook, like who haven't you talked to in a while that you would love to know, like what they're up to. And maybe just it can be easy, like, oh, we haven't talked in a while. I've been thinking about you. You've been on my heart.

And I saw a couple of posts and I immediately wanted to just say hi, see how you're doing and see what happens. But then also I say locally, go doing things that you love where you cultivate community as well. And so there's a lot of ways that we can create it. I think when we set the intention of creating soul sisterhood that it all shifts and we start to really attract the people that can hold space for us.

Yeah. I think it's a really important part. I've been much more intentional about my friendships than ever before. And for me, what it's looked like, like yesterday, I have a friend who we had a long list of different activities we wanted to do together.

And I was like, you know, let's go do this and let's go do this. And one of the things we said we were going to do was pottery class together. So yesterday we went and did a pottery class and then it was her birthday and we went and celebrated her birthday. And this morning I woke up and I was like.

You know, that was really cool because when I had my clinic, there's no way on a Tuesday. I could have stepped away from patients and like gone and done pottery with a friend and then gone to dinner with she and her husband and celebrated it. So I made an intentional effort to message her and just be like, thank you. Your friendship means the world to me and I really appreciate our day together.

Now, the busy version of me, younger version of me, might have never done that. But I am learning that the friendships I want to foster. I was like, I was going to say, I'm like, I am courting you right now, Mindy. I know, I know. We're menopausal dating. This is like, you know, I used to have this thing where my kids were little. I would say, I'm going to mommy date. I need to find some mommies. Now I feel like we're actually probably author dating, because I love all my, I love to find fellow authors.

But it's so fun to find somebody and say, I like your energy. I feel safe around you. How do we do more together? But you're right. We're totally courting each other. It's great. It's so good. It's so good. And I mean, I'm such a blessing to get to have you in my life. I mean, in the last couple of months when we've been sending memos, I've wanted to respect your time too. But I was like, I'm just going to admit it right here on the podcast. I'm courting Mindy right now.

Okay, I usually call it stocky. I usually say like I literally will tell people like I stalked you and then they laugh. I'm like, no, you don't understand. Like I just love what you're up to. I love who you are and I wanted to get to know you. It's just I say stock because it's funny. I was like, let me find a sexier.

Name for it. I mean, you're right. It's commitment. It's time, but it's so worth it. One of the other things that I did this year that really shifted a lot of my stress is I'm reading romantic fantasy books, and I have a whole list.

And but Alex is enjoying that exactly and I have all these book besties I keep gathering book besties because I'm a researcher by you know We're researchers by trade and so and I am consuming the I think I've read 45 of these since March So I am I'm going through a series and all the things and I'm I'm literally I've ranked book boyfriends You know I mean if you want to be like the ultimate book boyfriend I know who we and I know what series you need to read and so Oh my god, I have all these friends. This is yeah

They're reaching out and they're like, okay, I just finished this series. Oh my gosh. And it's just like, once someone's reading something that you loved, it's just this moment. And they're like, okay, what do I read next? And so I find I have all these memos coming in either either an Instagram or in my phone of like the next book, the next book boyfriend. And oh my God, so much fun. Okay, tell us where we go with romantic fantasies. I don't I where where's my door in and we should probably let everybody know because I'm going to go

So yeah, so I mean the big romantic fantasy author right now the two of them Rebecca Yarrows with the iron flame and fourth wing a little bit younger and then Sarah J. Mass has sold almost 5 million books this year. So throw in a glass and whoa a court of thorn and roses.

But my favorite book boyfriend is Luther, and he is in author Penn Cole, and it's the kindred curse saga. And book four is about to drop, so I'm so excited for that. Okay, I'm gonna go, I'm gonna have to, I love this. This is the power of collaboration, is learning things like this. So the other interesting thing is I have a friend who loves to travel, and so she asked me last year if I wanted to go to Turkey,

And I was like, yeah, let's go. And so we're actually going in two weeks. And then we both love to read books. And she's like, well, we need to read a book about Turkey. So she researched a novel, a historical novel. So we're now both reading it together before we go on this excursion. And it's just, this is soul food. Like this, like it, you know, maybe my 30 year old self wanted the big house and the nice car.

Soon to be a 55-year-old self just wants connection with humans and as many lovely ways as I can. Literally, I can't get enough of connections from heart-centered humans that fill my soul. It's become my quest for my life is to find those people that light me up.

I honestly think it's everything when I check in like what matters most and not that mission and purpose isn't so important and goodness knows that's been the driver my whole life but like when I tap into awe and joy and safety and belonging like it is spending time with my favorite people in real life as much as possible.

And so I have a birthday party plan this weekend and I'm literally only having this birthday party so I can bring my favorite people together. It is why I'm doing it. I wanna be the reason that people come together and so that to me is everything. At least right now, especially when again, rage takes over and anger and irritability and I want somewhere that's a safe place for me to express those emotions and they don't live in my house and they don't breathe

you know in a way that I don't like and so yes exactly yes I have a lot more compassion for my friends than I do my partner yeah

Well, and it does bring up an interesting thing that our partner can't be everything to us. And I've really tried to explain this to my husband, which is a hard thing to understand. It's like, when I go and I connect to my girlfriends, like I come back a more whole version of me and I can actually give to the relationship. And he's, he's starting to understand that. But again, it wasn't until I went through Perry Menopause.

that all of a sudden that became a necessity. It was like, I don't get away, don't get in front of me and my besties. Like, all I want to do is hang with them because they're the thing that makes me calm and happy at this point in my hormonal journey. So yeah, totally love this. Right.

Oh my gosh, I just love you and thank you, you know, just again, I'm watching what you're doing. I know you're embarking on writing a new book and I think it's the most important thing that's happening in the culture right now is so many of us are like, look, here was our experience.

And this is how we managed it. So, you know, I know in my heart that, like, we saved somebody's life today just by, like, being transparent with what we've gone through. So talk about where people find you. And I know you always have some good giveaways. Yes.

tell me how to do it.

Easy. I get. I get how busy life is. I get, you know, but I think that when we can punctuate our life with these beautiful safety signals to the brain, we just feel so much better throughout the day. So I built this with a very busy, very, very full scheduled woman in mind. And I'm so excited. Like these are things you can build into your day throughout the day with ease and grace.

Amazing. Well, so we'll leave links and thank you. I always am grateful when people give free stuff to my following because I'm an information junkie. So I know I would gobble that up. Okay, last question. This is one I've been asking this year and it just really, I love it because everybody says something different. What is your definition of health and how do you know when you're healthy?

My definition of health is having resilience and capacity. Feeling good in my heart, feeling good, just being able to just hum through the day. And how do I know? I'm doing a lot of body scans.

A lot of body check-ins. Oh, yeah. Really listening to my body, tuning, that's, again, that mind-body connection, I think is so critical. Obviously, I look at labs and all those things too. But that, I mean, I think a daily check-in, because women, I think, were the ultimate biohackers. I think we're the ultimate pivoters. Yes.

And so if I do a body scan and I'm like, ooh, like I'm feeling a little bit more tired or I feel like I need kind of a little reset, a walk reset, I will make that pivot in real, if I can in real time to kind of up level that energy. So yeah, that's how I'm looking. How much capacity I have for my son? That's how I'm gauging it, right? You know? Yes, yeah.

I think the body scan is really interesting because that's where I've gone too, is like checking in with, and that's an EMDR thing. I don't know, yeah, my therapist will say like, where you feel that in your body and it's, I really like that. So I just appreciate you so much. I can't wait for your next book to get out, which I know is going to be written and launched at supersonic, but your voice needs to be heard. So thank you for speaking up and helping us all. I just deeply appreciate you.

Thank you so much for joining me in today's episode. I love bringing thoughtful discussions about all things health to you. If you enjoyed it, we'd love to know about it, so please leave us a review, share it with your friends, and let me know what your biggest takeaway is.