We're listening to a more perfect union on KBLA Talk 1580. I'm Dr. Nick Cordolai-Corte, your host and Chief White House Correspondent. I'm in touch and so guess what? You be in touch. Follow me on all the social media platforms at Dr. Nick Cordolai. Just type in Dr. Nick Q. D-R-N-I-I-Q. It's just that simple. And boom, bam, boom. I pop right on up. Also be sure to download the KBLA app to listen to us live or on demand or simply
to play kbla talk fifteen eighty and there we are for your listening pleasure also subscribe to a more perfect union podcast powered by kbla talk fifteen eighty the only black owned and operated talk station west of the mississippi uh... now uh... you all hear me talk about toggling back and forth between washington d c l a all the time i have done that direct flight
Washington National Airport a million times. And so like so many of you, I am pained to see the devastation there with the plane crash that left no survivors. And so I'm thinking a lot about
those families as I'm sure you are thinking a lot about folks in d.c. that are in shock with with what happened the washington plane crash has also given way to a lot of questions a lot of questions are arising particularly over the understaffing at the control tower the guardian is reporting that uh... uh... the collision
just yesterday, between an American Airlines jet and a US military helicopter near Washington DC, killed all 67 people. All 67 people on board were killed, both aircraft and, and, um, sparked questions over whether understaffing in an air traffic control tower played a role.
in the united states worse aviation disaster in years as it approached reagan national airport around nine p.m. the american eagle flight fifty three forty two collided with u.s. army black hawk helicopter plunging wreckage of the uh... to aircraft into the icy patoma river uh... and uh... killing all aboard uh... but uh... preliminary investigation by the f-a-a found that staffing
staffing at the Reagan National Airport's control tower on Wednesday evening was, quote, not normal for the time of day and volume of traffic. That's according to the New York Times. The airport is one of three serving DC and, like many airports nationwide, a struggle to properly staff its control tower. The understaffing led to a single controller.
handling both arrivals and departures at the airport and also managing helicopter traffic a job usually handled by two people as reported by the new york times and so you know we're not jumping to conclusions i think there's still a lot of facts uh... to collect here uh... as of uh... airtime today uh... the black box has not been recovered yet uh... but this is an important
question that needs to be answered, what role did staffing and the lack thereof play in this tragedy? The crash was the first national tragedy to strike since President Trump was inaugurated last week. And at a White House press conference, the new president oscillated between consoling the nation and seizing on the deaths for political gain. We'll talk a little bit more about that later. But in other news,
Speaking of Trump, do you have an EV vehicle perhaps? You have an electric vehicle? Do you know anybody with an electric vehicle? If so, you may want to pay attention to this. Trump's pulling a U-turn on EVs, but not much has changed yet. NPR is reporting that in the summer of 2021, before an array of
Union made electric vehicles parked by the White House. Then President Joe Biden announced that he was setting an ambitious target. Remember this? He said, by the year 2030, 50% of new vehicles sold in the U.S. would be battery powered. There's no turning back. That's what President, then President Biden vowed before taking a joy ride in a plug-in electric Jeep. Now, President Trump
is trying to turn back, saying, quotes, we will revoke the electric vehicle mandate, saving our auto industry and keeping his sacred pledge to our great American auto workers. That's what he said in his inaugural address. He went on to say, in other words, you'll be able to buy the car of your choice, one of the first acts in office.
was to revoke Biden's 50% EV target. That target was never enforceable on its own. It served as a signpost for other policies that would have more tangible effects. But Trump removing the target doesn't change anything right now.
Consumer tax credits are still available. State mandates and federal emissions rules are still in place. That's because an executive action on its own can't undo or overwrite laws. And so pay attention to that. A lot of these executive orders have been signed. There's been a lot of headlines about these executive orders. But everything that glitters ain't gold, right? And so in other words, executive action on its own
Generally speaking, can't undo or overwrite laws. And so for those of you that may be thinking about, am I going to get an EV vehicle now? Am I going to wait to see what the landscape is shaping up to be considering the change in leadership in the White House? Hopefully this story provides you with a little bit of clarity. Moving along, today,
in washington very busy day on capital hill uh... struggling with your nomination that's what uh... one of the senator said there are several takeaways we have for you regarding rf k jr in tosy gabbard uh... and uh... uh... patel's uh... testimony uh... before
the United States Senate, three of President Trump's nominees. For top jobs in his administration, they faced some pretty tough questions from Democrats during the Senate confirmation hearing today. Two of them were also grilled by some Republicans highlighting concerns in Trump's own party about some of his unorthodox picks. People like Senator Bill Cassidy, a Republican from Louisiana, he pressed Trump's pick for health secretary, RFK Jr.
on his anti-vaccine views, particularly his debunked claims that vaccines cause autism. And he said he was struggling to support him.
Republican senators also repeatedly pushed Tulsi Gabbard, Trump's nominee for director of national intelligence on whether Edward Snowden, the former national security agency employee who leaked classified intelligence, remember that? They pressed him on being a traitor, a label that she avoided using to the frustration of some lawmakers. And then
There was Trump's nominee for FBI director, Cash Patel, who said he disagreed with the president's decision to grant clemency to his supporters who assaulted police officers during the U.S. Capitol riot on January 6, 2021. Meanwhile, the Senate Committee advanced Russell Vott, Trump's nominee to lead the Office of Management and Budget, who's been embroiled in a controversy over pausing federal funding. He also has connections to Project 2025.
So I would be surprised if they are not confirmed. There's a lot of tough talk here. It's a lot of back and forth. There's a lot of backbone and shoulder blade, but I don't know if that's gonna result in them not being confirmed. And so to me, it appears to be political theater. And so it's important for you to know
Because these are all agencies that will touch our everyday lives. The work of the health and human services that agency touches our everyday lives. When you think about the work of the CDC, the National Institute of Health, when you think about vaccines, when you think about the FDA making sure the drugs we take are safe for us and our families. Whoever leads that agency touches our everyday lives.
I don't need to tell you black folks history with the FBI. When you think about programs like Contell Pro, when you think about the FBI files that exist on a number of leaders in our community, a lot of the efforts to undermine and use the law as a bludgeon against folks in our community came out of the FBI. And so who runs that agency that matters?
Whoever the director of national intelligence is, that matters. And so this is why we are bringing this information to you because it matters. When we come forward, I'll tell you what else matters. It is this fight to advance racial justice no matter what. When we come forward, I'll be joined with Nikima Levy Armstrong.
She is a civil rights attorney and founder of the Racial Justice Network. We're gonna be talking about how Minnesota residents, everyday people, are calling for a nationwide boycott of target stores. Not calling for us to buy more products. They're calling for us to boycott target stores. We're gonna get the skinning on that and more. You are streaming and listening to a more perfect union on KBLA Talk 1580.
listening to and streaming a more pervunion on KBLA Talk 1580. I'm Dr. Nick Cordolai Corte and a lot of headlines have been swirling around boycotting target. A lot of folks really disappointed
that target has stepped back from its commitment to diversity, equity, inclusion, and not just target, but a number of brands, number of big brands. McDonald's, so many other brands that folks had grown to respect for creating opportunity for suppliers, for affirming
heritage months and and uh... celebrating diversity in all forms uh... and uh... target seems to be stepping back from that and to give us a closer look at that and more importantly the response from just ordinary people you know we've been talking about you know folks like tab of the brown among others you're stepping forward and and respecting differences of opinion but encouraging people to not uh...
leave some of these black-owned suppliers and black-owned products on the shelf. But here to help us make sense out of this, Nakeema Levy Armstrong. She's a civil rights attorney and founder of the Racial Justice Network. Nakeema, welcome to the show. Thank you for having me.
Well, thank you for being here. And so set the table for us. Minnesota residents are calling for a nationwide boycott of Target stores. You just heard me sort of, you know, orient people to what's been happening, at least in the news headlines of late. Why boycott target as opposed to, you know, some other organized action? Why boycott? Well, I think that
It's important for us to boycott, to send a message that we are not going to spend our black dollars where we are not welcomed and supported. And for a company like Target to make the decision to roll back its diversity, equity and inclusion, policies and initiatives and investments is unconscionable. Target has enjoyed a reputation as a beloved company
in the state of Minnesota, and they made significant commitments in the aftermath of the Minneapolis police killing of George Floyd. And so now, under the Trump regime, Target has made the decision that they no longer have to focus on diversity, equity, and inclusion. They've made a decision to rebrand some of their work under belonging.
And no one even really knows what that means. And we feel that their actions have been cowardly in the face of Donald Trump's actions and a slap in the face to black consumers who regularly patronize targets. Many of us rely upon targets for groceries, for household items, for back to school items for our children. But after the decision that they announced last week, they will not see another one.
of my black dollars or the dollars of my family and there are so many other people who feel the same way what what's your reaction in the reaction of folks on the ground to you know what we've heard from
folks like Tabitha Brown and other black people that have black-owned or black brands rather that are on target shelves that are saying, hey, I respect your point of view, but just sort of keep in mind.
Keep in mind that, you know, if folks don't show up to target to purchase these products, these products may go buy-by. And so, you know, what's your response to some of the black brands that are saying, hold up. Don't leave us on the shelf. Well, I empathize with them to a certain degree. I'm also a black entrepreneur and I understand the difficulty
of, you know, creating a product and, you know, trying to get it on shelves and connecting with customers. It can be expensive. It can take a long time. And it takes a lot of determination to persevere through that type of process. And so black entrepreneurs have worked really hard to get on target shelves. But in a moment like this,
I don't feel that we can compromise and say, go into Target during Black History Month and only buy Black products. Because at the end of the day, Target is still going to benefit from our dollars being spent inside of Target stores. And beyond that, the entrepreneurs have to split any proceeds that they make with Target just because of the expense of having shelf space at Target.
So it is going to cost black entrepreneurs something, you know, when they have that shelf space. But what we are saying is that people should go to the websites of their favorite black brands that they normally patronize at Target and buy directly from black entrepreneurs. We do not want Target to profit a single dollar off of black bodies. And here's the other thing to think about.
the timing of Target's announcement to roll back its diversity, equity and inclusion initiatives. They waited until after the holiday season. So after all of us had bought toys and gifts and all the things that we needed to celebrate during the holidays. And one week before Black History Month, which is generally a time in which Black folks go to Target to celebrate
and purchase from their favorite black brands. They're usually really nice displays and new products that are out. So it's a time of excitement for the black community when we get to the point of black history month. And so from my perspective, it was disrespectful to those black brands for target to make this announcement one week before black history month. I do not feel that that was a coincidence. And even if it was a coincidence, the bottom line is that
it was inconsiderate of them to make this decision. And beyond that, they didn't prep black brands for their announcement. They didn't give them a heads up. Those black brands found out the same time as the rest of this country that Target was making such a significant decision regarding their diversity, equity, and inclusion initiatives. So from my perspective, that feels very disrespectful to those black brands that are in Target.
And we're not going to rubber stamp in a firm that disrespect by going into target stores to buy from black brands simply because it's black history month. In honor of our ancestors, we need to do what they did, which is to not compromise with the system. And I'm thinking specifically about the Montgomery bus boycott, which lasted for 381 days.
after Rosa Parks made the decision to not give a proceed to a white man. Now, you had people who had to get to work, had to get to church, had to get to their family's homes or whatever they had to do. They said, no matter what, I'm not going to take the bus. I'm going to find alternative means of transportation. And because of their sacrifice and refusing to cooperate with the racist system,
Now everywhere around the country, we can sit wherever we want on a bus. We don't have to sit in the back or be denied access to wherever we want to be on a bus. And so in honor of our ancestors and the fact that February 1st is Black History Month, we need to do what they did and not compromise.
well we know we hear you uh... loud and clear here about not compromising i think uh... jalani who's saying who's the executive director of the minnesota chapter of the council on islamic american relation said that as a company in the city
where George Floyd's murder sparked a national, dare I say, even international reckoning with racial injustice, he says, target must be called out. Target must be called out. And so for folks who are wondering, well, you know, why is target catching so much heat? It's part of his because target is at the epicenter of what had been an inflection point.
in the work of racial justice in this country. When we come forward, I want to ask you sort of where do we go from here in this current environment?
We know that Target is not alone in terms of having stepped back from their espoused values, having stepped back from their commitment. Just today, we saw President Trump has sparked an outcry with implications that DI policies are at fault for the mid-air collision in Washington, D.C. When we come forward, I'm going to get Nakeema, Levy Armstrong's take on that and more. You are listening to and streaming a more perfect union on KBLA Talk 1580. And by the way,
Whatever folks are saying in your group chat, we want you to put it in the chat. For those of you that are streaming live on YouTube, we want you to weigh in on this. What's your thoughts on the Target Boycott? Are you going to be boycotting Target? We want to hear from you. You're listening to a more perfect union on KBLA Talk 1580.
While listening to and streaming a more perfect union on KBLA Talk 1580, I'm Dr. Nick Cordalag-Corté and really delighted to be in conversation today with a leader on the front lines.
Levy Armstrong, Levi Armstrong, is a civil rights attorney and founder of the Racial Justice Network. She's among a number of folks on the ground in Minnesota calling for a nationwide boycott of Target stores. Of course, today, President Trump's remarks, really his passive aggressive remarks, if we want to
be honest, his remarks really pulled focus away from the victims of the D.C. crash and attempted to malign the folks that are engaged in the fight to protect and preserve diversity, equity, and inclusion to advance racial justice. Nakeema, what did you make of the President's remarks today on DEI?
I thought the president's remarks were truly asinine and nonsensical. And it's sad that someone at the highest level of our government is speaking to the people as though he were of second or third grader and not the leader of the free world to blame diversity, equity, and inclusion on such a major tragedy under his leadership.
makes absolutely no sense and it's important to note that you know president trump spent a considerable amount of time discussing the federal aviation administration's d.i. initiatives particularly under president biden and president obama he cited the f.a.a.'s acknowledgment of the under employment of employees with disabilities and you know week before he took office he said that the f.a.a. website said that
quotes people severe disabilities are the most underrepresented segment of the workforce uh... and that they they want them to be air traffic controllers he said i don't think so and so you know this is somebody who you know is not for d i in in any form
whether it is supporting the interests of black folks, of women, of LGBTQ folks, and people who are disabled, all of which happen to be folks that target had proudly stepped up to support. And so, Nikima, isn't this part of the reason?
why folks are a little bit more upset with Target. It's because Target was a bit more of a standard bear when it came to diversity equity inclusion, though. Well, on some level, yes. So Target had a history of having more progressive policies and investment in communities of color and initiatives that promoted diversity. However,
There is another side to target, which we talked about today during the press conference. And that includes target having a longstanding surveillance program that has had a disparate impact on people of color and was used to train law enforcement officers here in Minnesota. There was also a report that came out last year by one of our
media outlets called Unicorn Riot, which tied target funding to some of the initiatives in the Hennepin County Attorney's Office, including when now Senator Amy Klobuchar was the Hennepin County Attorney that actually led to disproportionate impacts to black youth. So in other words, we have young black men who were incarcerated during that time,
And some of those young men were actually innocent. Some have since been released from prison thanks to some of the more progressive policies of the New County Attorney. So Target has had, I would say, a mixed history with regard to diversity, equity, and inclusion. And also its connection to surveillance and law enforcement and even trespassing black people at disproportionate rates from their stores.
So I think part of why people are more upset at Target, at least here in Minnesota, is because of the fact that Target is in the location, the headquarters is in the location where we had worldwide uprising, as you mentioned earlier, in the aftermath of George Floyd being killed. Now many folks may not know that our movement for police accountability and racial justice began
at least six or seven years before George Floyd was killed. So we were marching and demonstrating and shutting things down and showing up in the halls of power and demanding racial justice and accountability right in the heart of Target headquarters, right, which is downtown Minneapolis. So Target knows the problems that communities of color experience here and the racial disproportionality and inequality
So to turn its back on the people who have supported Target and help Target become such a huge company is a slap in the face.
Yeah, I mean, I get it. And I'm also paying attention to the folks that are in the chat on our YouTube channel. And if you aren't, you might want to be really appreciate Selena Ricks, who is real clear. She says she ain't giving them her money. She ain't doing it. Selena, I asked her in the chat, how long are you willing to boycott Target and where will you go instead? And, you know, Selena was very clear. She said for as long as it takes.
She plans to shop local black businesses and or online and she thinks that we should be shopping and banking black as well. And so to the point that you made earlier, you're not saying don't support black businesses, don't support black brands that happen to be on target shelves. You're saying, you can still support them, just go directly to the source.
Skip that. Absolutely. And they'll receive a larger cut. Right. They'll receive more profits from selling direct to the consumer as opposed to having to give target a cut of their proceeds based on the cost of having space on their shelves. So I just, like I said before, I am of the mind that we cannot compromise at a moment like this. We would be sending target a message that we're only half serious.
well and when it comes to fighting for racial justice we have to be all in yeah we we have to be all in and and there's another question in the chat uh... terry tarry uh... ask how do people uh... know whether companies know whether it's a black white age latino middle eastern jewish i am a consumer uh... i assume
Um, there are, there are a lot of analytics that they get on, on, uh, our purchases as consumers. Uh, there's a lot of marketing that goes into, uh, getting us not just in the store, but as you walk around target, you know, things are displayed in a certain way, depending on which target stores you go to and what neighborhoods, right? They, they know their audience. They know, they know,
They know how to engage consumers and get you to leave those dollars at their door. And so that's why this is a little bit of a shell game. Because as much as people may be stepping back from diversity, equity, and inclusion,
Um, it's in some ways been baked into their business, right? Call it what you want to, right? Micro targeting, you know, uh, multicultural marketing, right? Uh, we know that the, the, the countries demographics are shifting. The consumer demographics are shifting, uh, attitudes and behaviors are shifting. And you know, there are some companies that are going to shift
along with where consumers are going, and there are those that want to ISIS in the past, right? And so what is your closing argument to companies that are peers to target that maybe considering taking similar steps to target, maybe considering taking a step back from their commitment to diversity, equity, and inclusion? I'm going to give you a chance to answer that.
When we come forward, it's time for the quiet part out loud. Nakeema is going to stick around. You are listening to and streaming a more perfect union on KBLA Talk 1580. A critically important conversation with a leader on the front lines. Nakeema Levi Armstrong. She's a civil rights attorney and founder.
of the racial justice network, right before the break, the key I was asking you, what's your advice? What's your guidance to companies like Target that are feeling froggy and feeling like, you know, this might be the time to step back from their commitments, diversity, equity, and inclusion in every form. What say you?
I think that those companies need to realize that rolling back their efforts to focus on diversity, equity, and inclusion is bad for business. It's inevitable that the United States will continue to brown as a country. And we will be the majority if not already. Globally, we are already the majority. So even when we're called minorities, that's a misnomer.
We'll never hear white folks calling themselves minority, even when they are definitely in the minority. So we should not accept that terminology because globally, as a people of color, we are already in the majority. I want to lift up what has happened thus far with Costco. And I'm hoping that Costco is able to hold the line and not fold. But recently, 100% of Costco's board
recommended to their shareholders that they not roll back diversity, equity, and inclusion initiatives, and 98% of shareholders voted to keep those initiatives intact. So you have a lot of folks who are now going to be shopping at Costco. And I'm not telling people to shop at Costco. I think that people need to choose what makes the most sense for them. I think focusing on local businesses, black owned businesses, women owned businesses,
It's very important at this time because those businesses don't get enough attention even though a lot of times they're loyal to the communities that they serve and those dollars are more likely to cycle in through our community when we are shopping local as compared to what's happening when we're constantly patronizing these big box stores who show that they don't truly value our business. So I'm hoping that Costco is able to stand firm. I know that there are
Republican attorneys general that are currently and actively applying pressure to Costco and trying to get them to roll back their policies. So that's something we'll be watching for to see what happens there. But these other companies need to feel the pain when they turn away from diversity, equity, and inclusion. You've mentioned some of the companies, McDonald's. I know that Walmart is another company, Amazon.
meta that rolled back their policies and they have not felt the heat in the way that they should. And so for us here in Minnesota, we're saying, no, enough is enough. You're now on our turf and we're not going to let this slide. And the reality is that Target has 2000 stores around the country. So they will feel the impact if people join this national boycott and decide to no longer spend there, they're going to have to do something.
Maybe they can go to Trump for a bill out since they bow down to him so quickly. But I know they're not getting my black dollars at the end of the day unless and until they reverse course. And speaking of black dollars in the chat, H.W., talking about how at a minimum, we should be getting the savings account at a black bank and putting the savings there while using other banks for checking. That would be a big improvement, right? And so I just think the point of this conversation
is that if we are to get to the other side of whatever this is, whatever this moment this is, I've said this on this show before and I'll say it again, we gotta do it in community. We gotta do it in community. Absolutely. Right, and I think it was Alice Walker who said that the fastest way we give away our power is by believing we have none in the first place.
And I think one of my big takeaways from our conversation, the schema is that we have power and everybody gets to choose that it's not just target that gets to say, okay, you know, we're going to step back from this commitment or meta or McDonald's or Amazon. I mean, the list goes on and on, you know, but, you know, we all get to choose how we're going to participate, how we're going to participate in this economy. And, you know, where we're going to invest our dollars.
I would just want to emphasize something that Nikima said just a short while ago that this is not about turning our back on black brands and black businesses. Because I've seen a little bit of that sort of on social, right? And so we just want to correct that. That's not what Nikima is saying. That's not what this is about. She's saying, look, we can still support black brands. We can still support black businesses. Just support them directly.
You don't gotta go through Amazon for everything. You ain't got to go through, you know, target.com for everything, right? Because if there is no consequence, and I think this is a part of your closing argument, and feel free to add to it, but I think part of your closing argument, you know, is that, you know, we don't have to dance to their tune. We don't have to do that.
Right? And if there is no consequence to their decisions to step back from our communities because there's a new sheriff in town, a new president in town, it's not in Vogue anymore, right? Well, you know, we have a chance to vote with our wallets and vote with our feet. Absolutely. That's spot on in terms of my perspective and many others here in the Twin Cities of Minnesota.
who are saying, look, enough is enough. We let all these other companies slide as the black community. But here, the place where George Floyd was killed, not today. That's how we got to the point where there was a global uprising, because we had been fighting long before George Floyd was killed, trying to get them to change the laws and the policies. And we were persistent, whether we had to march in Bluthert
Whether we had to deal with rubber bullets and tear gas, we continue to show up consistently. So that's what it's going to take us as a people, making up our minds that we are not going to tolerate this disrespect. We are not going to have our humanity diminished because of who is in the White House. And we are going to stand on the shoulders of those who came before us and who have already taught us the way.
It's up to us to follow those lessons. And that's what I plan to do. Nikima, how can people be a part of the work that you're doing on the ground in Minnesota, the work that the racial justice network is doing inside and outside of Minnesota? Where can people go to tap in and be a part of what you're building? So people are welcome to follow me on Facebook where I post
about these issues. We had a huge dialogue over the weekend with Minnesota residents and many of them expressed their anger and outrage at Target saying that they had to cut up their red cards and they weren't going to shop there anymore. And then we talked about taking collective action. And so that's how we got to the point of deciding on a national boycott. So people can follow my Facebook page. They can also follow Black Lives Matter Minnesota. They are a partner with us in this work.
We have a racial justice network page as well in care of Minnesota. And we are also partnering with national organizations that are going to help push this boycott and also get the word out to their constituents. So you will see more to come. But right now, everyone should know if they agree that what target has done is unacceptable and unconscionable, that they can participate first and foremost by deciding
not to shop there and finding other places to invest their dollars and including and especially black owned businesses and local businesses and also black banks and credit unions as uh uh Selena one of our leaders learners and listeners online has said uh black banks and credit unions they need our dollars and and so we should we should uh you know support them because they support a lot of businesses
in need of capital. And really in our remaining minute, Nikim, I just want to put a finer point on this because I know this has also been raised as points been raised. What's the difference with target not boycotting and with basically boycotting target versus just shopping black brands?
Again, I think as I understand it from your vantage point, Target is the middle person. And as the middle person, Target takes a cut out of every product that is on their shelf, every product that is in their store. And so if you cut Target out of the equation, it's actually a larger share to black brands and black businesses, no? Absolutely. And that larger share can lead to more jobs.
and more buying power for those businesses. If I think about Tabitha Brown's company, for example, during her video, she said she had been on target shelves for five years. And she has been very successful. And my hope would have been that within that five years, she could have used some of her power and her resources to build a stronger infrastructure outside of Target so that it didn't come to this.
But I'm hoping that this is a wake-up call for those black brands to figure out how to secure themselves. Because at any point in time, Target could have decided, hey, as part of us rolling back DEI, we're going to take these brands off the shelves. Because who is there to hold them accountable? They can do that tomorrow if they wanted to. And so we need to understand that there is not any security for these businesses, simply because they have secured shelf space at Target.
Well, our thanks to Nakeema Levi Armstrong. We appreciate you and everything that you do. And want to encourage people to tap into the work that she's leading. Please, please, please come back again soon.
Thank you so much for having me. This was an awesome conversation. Thank you for being here. When we come forward, Lee Smiley is joining us, the president of the Institute for Diversity Certification. We're going to continue this conversation with diversity, equity, inclusion at a crossroads. What's next in the future of diversity, equity, and inclusion, which is being tested like never before? You're listening to a more perfect union on KBLA Talk 1580. More when we come forward. KBLA 1580.