Ep. 123 How To Curate A Career You Love By Taking Every Opportunity With Irene Agbontaen
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January 27, 2025
TLDR: Irene Agbontaen, frustrated by lack of fashion options for tall women, founded TTYA (Taller Than Your Average) in 2018. She curated a multifaceted career post-brand success through hustle and adaptation. Challenges included securing first orders from prominent retailers and staying true to herself.

In the latest episode of the podcast, titled "How To Curate A Career You Love By Taking Every Opportunity With Irene Agbontaen," the journey of entrepreneur Irene Agbontaen is laid bare. She is the founder of TTYA (Taller Than Your Average), a brand dedicated to providing stylish clothing for taller women, a market she felt was sorely lacking during her previous jobs in retail. This engaging episode dives deep into her life, career transitions, the challenges faced, and numerous opportunities seized along the way.
Irene’s Early Life and Aspirations
Irene shares insights into her childhood in South London, outlining a background steeped in hard work and resilience, stemming from her West African roots. Growing up in a household that valued academic success, she felt the pressure to excel, which helped shape her disciplined work ethic. However, she also expressed the desire for something more than just traditional career paths, igniting her entrepreneurial spirit early on.
Key Takeaways:
- Influence of Family: Irene's Nigerian upbringing instilled a strong work ethic and an acute awareness of community.
- Desire for More: Despite academic success being highly valued, Irene sought to break the mold and create something unique.
Finding Her Way in Fashion
Through various retail jobs, particularly at Selfridges, Irene cultivated an understanding of merchandising and the clothing industry. However, it wasn’t until her first significant opportunity at a fashion trade show in Barcelona that she began to see the potential for a brand focused on taller women.
The Birth of TTYA
Irene's frustration with ill-fitting clothing for taller women propelled her to take action. Seeing few options available for women like herself, she decided to start TTYA not just as a brand but as a movement advocating for inclusion in fashion.
Entrepreneurial Insights:
- Seizing Opportunities: Ignoring fear, Irene boldly approached fashion professionals, resulting in her first break in the industry.
- Community Matters: Building connections through her retail experiences was pivotal in advancing her career.
Hustle and Overcoming Challenges
The podcast discusses Irene's experience of hustling to establish TTYA, including the various challenges she faced, such as launching her brand without a clear path. Her resourcefulness was evident when she secured her first order from Selfridges, marking a significant milestone.
Challenges Include:
- Logistical Hurdles: Learning about the intricate logistics involved in supply chain management and retail partnerships.
- Financial Risks: Navigating financial pressures from product deliveries, including liabilities and insurance requirements.
The Power of Saying Yes
A significant theme in Irene's journey is the idea that saying yes to opportunities—even when they seem daunting—has fueled her growth. From working nights in clubs to launching a fashion line, her willingness to embrace new experiences has served her well.
Important Lessons:
- Flexibility: Embracing the changes and learning from setbacks fosters resilience.
- Collaborative Spirit: Building partnerships and networking effectively can open doors.
Building a Brand and Community
Irene emphasizes that TTYA is not just a brand; it signifies a community and a voice for those who often feel overlooked in fashion. As she navigates the entertainment industry, she highlights the importance of diversity and inclusion in shaping brand narratives.
Community Impact:
- Empowering Others: TTYA has become a platform for mentoring and encouraging women, particularly tall women, to embrace their identities.
- Creating Space: Irene aims to cultivate spaces where underrepresented voices can thrive and be heard.
Homeownership Journey
Towards the episode's end, the discussion shifts to Irene’s personal milestones, including her journey to homeownership and the lessons learned along the way. She elaborates on the significance of financial independence and the hurdles of being a female homeowner in a male-dominated industry.
Homeownership Highlights:
- Empowering Narrative: Irene shares her struggles with builders and the vital importance of advocating for her needs during renovations.
- Sharing Knowledge: Through social media, she aims to educate others about the complexities of home buying and renovation.
Conclusion: Curating Your Career
Irene Agbontaen’s story is one of fortitude, creativity, and the relentless pursuit of personal and professional growth. Her reflections on embracing challenges and taking every opportunity are invaluable lessons for aspiring entrepreneurs.
Final Thoughts:
- Know Your Worth: A crucial takeaway is to always know your value and not be afraid to advocate for what you deserve in any professional setting.
- Continuous Learning: Irene’s journey exemplifies that every experience—whether successful or challenging—is an opportunity for growth.
Overall, this episode serves as a powerful reminder to curate a career that aligns with your passions, by being proactive, resilient, and open to the diverse paths that life unfolds.
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Irene Agbontain is someone whose career is defined by being the change she wanted to see. Back in 2018, she was working in selfages and becoming increasingly frustrated at the lack of clothes on the market for taller women. So she took matters into her own hands and founded TTYA, which stands for taller than your average. The brand saw monumental success being worn by huge celebrities like Kylie Jenner,
right from the beginning. However, Irene says it was never about her brand. Instead, it was about opening up a conversation about inclusion. One thing that really struck me throughout Irene's career is how much she built this career block by block. She's now in a full-time job. She still has this business. She's still been really, really committed to
her journey and what she wants to change about the world. What I really wanted from this episode is to show how much you can really build your career from a number of different things that you're good at by really just saying yes to opportunities. She is such a good example of that. I honestly like just wait till you hear her whole career trajectory and how she's made each decision. I think it's really, well it's very inspiring for me and I think that it
is really empowering to know how much you can decide your future by saying yes to opportunities by working hard and by just kind of saying yes and figuring out the rest after.
Before we get into the podcast, if you could just go and rate this on whichever podcast app you are listening to this on, it makes a huge difference to the podcast and the types of incredible conversations we're able to have, the types of guests we're able to get on. So no, it's probably something you don't think about. But if you could just go rate it now or follow it, it makes a huge difference. Thank you so much.
Thank you so much for joining me. Thank you for having me. I'm very excited for this conversation. I feel like we're going to have a lot to talk about. We're going to get into the just bips. I always always always always start with early life. I would just love for you to paint us a picture of what early life looked like for you. Yeah, for sure.
I'm South London, born and raised, still am at heart. And I think for me, it's been so interesting over the years because I've seen so how South London has morphed and shaped every element of my life, if I'm really going to be honest. I come from a West African household. I'm Nigerian. So I always say I'm like, UK via Lagos. But my mom's Nigerian, my dad's Nigerian. I grew up with my mom. I'm the eldest of four kids.
And I know it is a lot. I'm saying, girl, that's why I feel like I'm a bit of a control freak if I'm honest because I've been like a micro manager of like the siblings life for like the rest of their whole lives. But I think it was, you know, seeing how much my mum worked so hard and it's installed in me, sometimes good things, sometimes bad, you know, I think
her interpretation of what success is, is very much like, you know, academic, being a doctor, being a nurse, you know, that's a very typical, I would say, Nigerian upbringing, like successes, you know, equals academic career. You know, so I think for me,
Also, it was like they success to them was also being a hard worker, not necessarily a smart worker. So just like working hard to provide, sending money back home, you know, helping all their family and friends back home. It wasn't about like thinking about, okay, I'm in the UK. How do I build and leverage here? It was always like with a short-sighted intention of like, this is just a pit stop. And I'm probably going to end up retiring back home. Obviously, it never really happened. And I think... Still time.
There's still time if she wants to move back. I'm sure she will, but I think it was growing up. It was always the mentality of I need to work hard. I'm supporting my mum and my parents and my other siblings back home. So every month I work and I send money back home or, you know, my, I'm going to, you know, my, my grand is building a house. Okay. I'm going to work, send money back home so my grand can do that.
that came with its own kind of push and pull because she never had the mentality of I'm going to be stable here. What opportunities are here for me? Should I be getting on the property ladder really early? It was just like, you know, we lived in a council estate. Let's just make ends meet. Let's just get by it. And I think that mentality with her hard work always kind of in the back of my mind,
I always wanted more like I always just to me when I grew up I grew up on an estate which was my first interaction of community everyone used to knock for you like can you come play outside you know everything that we used to see the people that had money were like people who sold drugs and like you know people our community leaders
were people that we saw had money and so for us we were just like okay like he's got a new car you know he has always the freshest gums but the community is what held each other up and even our style sense of like
like CNA and like Capoboma Jackie, and like, you know, rope chains and like being inspired by like 90s hip-hop. I think for me growing up seeing that we're on the streets on the roadsides also empowered my creativity. I didn't realize it at the time, but now when I look back, I think it did.
But I think they're real sense of community of growing up on a council estate, like, and having everything that you need within arms reach. Oh, my mom's working late tonight. Our community babysitter was a lady called Auntie Wilma, and she used to basically babysit all the kids locally. We all went to the same school.
And so she was almost like the community hangout sport. Everyone used to hang outside her house or the kids used to hang inside her house. So, you know, for us, there was that real sense of community growing up. And it was just like, okay, that shifted for me. I would say as I got older when I started in a workplace because
And even at college, I went to SFX, which is a South London college. And I think most of my friends, after we left school, I ever went to SFX, or they went to Christ the King. Those are the two kind of real colleges. South London, deep, weird colleges, where most people kind of divided and conquered. And I think now, like, when I look back, there was like tiny temples and went to SFX. There's like so many people that came from that real humble South London beginning.
And a lot of us had similar paths because we all ended up at the same college. And even going to uni, I went to a very popular uni. I went to Kingston uni. But then some of my friends went to Brunel. Some went to Luton. So there was that very sense of community. Like, you know, we had ACS crew, which was like African Caribbean society at all the different uni. So like, you know, we'll drive to Luton to go club M and then they would come to Kingston to go to the works. And I would go Brunel for like, you know, ACS raves.
again it was just that real sense of community and people traveling to see each other and I'll be honest I grew up predominantly in Clapham and Brixton so I never really saw the race divide I would say until I really went into the workplace just because in the area that I lived it was heavily Nigerians, heavily Jamaicans,
You know, I remember Brixton KFC would be like Jamaica Central, Peckham would be Nigeria Central. So, you know, growing up for me, all my school was a very diverse school. My college was a very diverse college. Even at uni was very, very diverse. I would say it's only really when I went into the workplace and you would start to see that there was a bit of a shift. And, you know, for me growing up, we didn't grow up with like,
you know, exponential amounts of money, like, you know, we just live to get by. So as soon as I was, as I was old enough, I remember my, my neighbor come running to my house when she got her N.I. card and I was like, my money to get my N.I. number, like, I want to be able to work. And then it was like healthy competition. And then she would run over and knock me, I got my driving license. I'd be like,
actually get a drive license. I need to get my drive in license. So we were like very, very like independent women from a very young age, but also equally we knew that everything that we wanted in life we had to work for. So retail was a lot of like students second job. And you know, I grew up working in, you know, on the high street, you know, understanding retail, understanding like merchandising, understanding how you made something look good for customers to want it to be desirable.
So all of that obviously I didn't know what was waiting for me later on in life but just having those kind of real humble retail beginnings I would say really set me up for TTYA later on in life and then again like because I always
had to kind of facilitate for myself to work and be able to kind of support myself. I used to like do the door at a club night, you know, and just to get by, make some money, but also like build my network. And I think that was the real foundation for me where I really started to see the intersections of fashion and music and lifestyle and how they all came together.
What was because you've painted a picture of a few different versions of success. You've said that success for your parents was like being a doctor or a nurse and success for your estate was whoever had the money. So you said a lot of the time that drugs were involved with that. What was when you were coming generally out of education in your mind, what would success have looked like for you in the future? What were you working towards?
I think at that time, transparently, I was just working towards getting good grades. I wasn't really thinking that far ahead. And I'll be honest with you, I think my upbringing of seeing people calm, people go. I lost a lot of close friends, you know, to the road life. So I never ever really wanted to be one of those people that's like, I need a five-year plan. I need a 10-year plan. I've always never been like that. And I'm still not really to this day.
like I've always kind of worked with a short short-sighted thinking of just like okay at that time success was getting good grades because I wanted my mom to be proud I know the sacrifices that she had made and I knew she would be disappointed if at the end of like going to college or going to uni my grades were just not great you know and she would I know she would feel that personally of like I've failed as a parent so at that time success was just
getting good grades, making my mum happy, and then being free to basically go do what I want. And when you looked into your future in terms of career, was, did you have any idea of what you kind of wanted to do?
At that time, I didn't. If I'm going to be 100% honest, I didn't. I did like retail because I was using retail as a way to support myself through college. But I was always good at science academically. I was always good at science. I did a science degree. I did a forensic science degree. So academically, I was very good at science. And I would say like probably CSI gas me to feel like I really thought that like that was like where I wanted to be like CSI. But it was, I would say,
Academically, I was just thinking about, how do I just get past this moment and get good grades? I didn't think, oh, this is my end goal, this is my dream job. It was just like, I kind of like this and I kind of like retail because I was in a retail space and I'll just figure it out when I'm done. So what was your first full-time job? My first full-time job was working at Selfridges.
Yeah, in the shop floor. Yeah, I was doing part time while I was studying and then when I finished uni, obviously that summer, you don't have anything to do. So I went full time and I was doing like visual merchandising. I was doing stock take. So I would always be in selfages when it was empty, which is put usually the best times. So I know that still now, like the back of my hand, I work there for five and a half years.
But i i interned a bit at the merchandising department so they used to do all the windows displays and they were in charge of like how the product looked and i think those early days working in that department showed me about like how i think it was all about like lilon scott at that time and just like polynics and like
Kanye was having his resurgence with Ralph Lauren, so it was like very much Polynic driven and how like you could display something in a way like a baggy Polynic is pinned at the back and everything's tweaked and nothing really looks like how you think it's gonna look. Those are the early days of like me really understanding how merching dies in and creating your brand and visual identity is important to how well you're brand self.
And when did you first start to realise that you wanted to start a brand of your own? After I finished Selfridges, I met there used to be a really big fashion trade show called Bread and Butter. Used to happen in Barcelona back in the day, Berlin and Barcelona.
and my boyfriend at the time used to read Complex magazine and he used to get it delivered to my house and I remember used to see all the covers it was like very hip-hop inspired but you know very a mix of like sports locks meets high fashion my boyfriend at the time used to get it sent to my house and that magazine for me was a
The first time that I had seen music and high fashion really hand in hand, I think Kanye was on the cover, it was very much giving high-key low-key, uptown, downtown, right? And I remember going to this trade show and they had a stand at the trade show and I walked up to the lady on the stand and I was like,
I would love to get into styling. I've just been kind of assisting and doing a few little styling bits in London, doing visual merchandising at Selfieges. I would love to get into styling more on the editorial side. Do you have the contact for the fashion editor? And she turned around and she was like, oh, it's a good thing that you're speaking to her then. You don't really need the contact. What is it that you want to do? And her name was Anoma Yai Whittaker. And to this day, she's been my biggest advocate, my biggest supporter. She gave me my first opportunity, my first job in fashion.
And she was basically like, would you come to New York to work for me? She's from East London. She was at London now. She moved to New York when she was 19. And she was like, you just remind me so much of me. Like when I was trying to have my first hustle, get on the ladder for the first time. So if you're prepared to like move to New York, I'd love to email you like a task to do. And I was thinking, yeah, right. Like as if she's going to email me. So I was like, yeah, cool. Like I'll email your sister. She was like, yeah, I'll put you in touch with my assistant. And you can just email her. I was thinking, yeah, right.
Right, she's bluffing me off. But she did, she did. She put me in touch with her assistant. They sent me some bogus tasks to do. Some people do, I remember I think at the time with like Levi's and the buttons on the jeans or something and like researching it. And she basically gave me an opportunity to come and work for her, come in intern for her in New York. And I moved to work for her. And that's how I left Selfridges in the end. And I moved to New York and she was a fashion at our complex.
You know, that was my real first like starting from the bottom. Now we hear job like it was getting the bagels getting the coffees, you know, you know, you know, prepping all the suitcases for shoots, staying up really late. And I remember being like, you know, like when you're away from home, everything at home seems so much more fun. Like everyone was Facebook those days. So like everyone on Facebook was like in Dulston, like having the time of their life. And I remember being like, I'm so lonely. Like there's no one here.
But I remember thinking, like, the reason why I'm here is to learn, you know, and even she picked up on it. And I remember one day we had just done a cover shoot and she was like, I don't really feel like you're feeling it. And I was like, it's not that. It's just that I have a community back home. And I don't really feel like I have a community here. So it's a bit difficult for me to integrate. And it's called that everyone wants to be my friend because I work at Complex magazine, but who? Right.
Who do I stand for outside of that? And she was like, I'm going to tell you something that no one really knows. I'm pregnant. Obviously we work with a lot of hip-hop artists. I can't go to them shoots no more. Like there's too much smoking, like there's too much going on. So I'm going to need you to really lead on some of those shoots and like go to events and represent for me. So every invite she would get a member like I went to this huge like run DMC party on behalf of complex.
you know and so that way i started to build up my community and that's why new york will always have like a special part in my heart because i remember i moved in i lived off like dollar pizza i was still paying bills in london i still had my phone bill i never really disconnected so it was like every i now became my mom it's like i was living in new york but then sending money back home
just to keep the bills, just to keep myself going, but never really understanding where this was going to lead. But it did give me that real editorial experience and it allowed me to build my relationships with PR, understanding how that whole pulling works behind the scenes in fashion. But it also made me feel like I don't really want to work on the editorial site. I just thought there's no money here. I don't see this being a longevity moment. I think it's really cool that I get to work with. We shot a Pharrell cover and we shot a Kanye cover
a Jim Jones cover.
But I like the side of like the unexpected. I like working with musicians. So how does that feed into what I want to do? But ultimately I traveled so much equally. So also for me, it was like I travel a lot. I like going away with my friends. I never have anything that fits growing up, even when our school introduced that the girls could wear trousers and never had trousers that fit me. So everything was always ankle swingers, wrist swingers, you know,
And I would say because I wrecked in selfages, I found a way to kind of navigate my style. It was always men's double XL. It was always like a 36 waist gene. And I'd get it tailored to fit my waist, but it would be super baggy. Like Elia was like the style guru of all style gurus because it was like, you know, masculine meets femininity femininity femininity.
Um, but at that junction, she would always wear like super Becky Tommy, all figure and like, you know, like an oversells, like Carl Kanai jacket or waistcoat. So I was like, as a tall girl, I never had anything that fit. So I would always be wearing men's clothes. And I remember that was the first time that I was like, oh, it's so annoying that when I'm packing on these shoots, I've always got to be thinking, what am I going to wear? Or like in New York, they had like,
big and high and mighty, and like going to these stores that were just so tacky and not cool, but trying to like make it work, you know? And I remember thinking after that, like, I think I need to like start my own brand, but I never had the confidence to do it. So I kind of just parked it here and then recession happened in New York.
And they were basically like, we can't afford to pay you to stay here anymore. You need to go home. And I remember before I left New York, I had applied to ASOS. And they gave me an interview when I came back. And then I went to be the fashion stylist at ASOS. And then it was as seen on screen. So it wasn't the big conglomerate that we know it to be now.
But starting at a business that early and starting at econ business that early, now I'm morphing my shops, shop retail skills. I'm now morphing editorial and now I've gone into e-commerce. And I would say that, you know, ASOS was probably one of the market leaders at that time of ripping off like celeb dresses and like being like, this is seen on Victoria Beckham. Get it for nine pound. Like this has been seen on Sheryl Cole. Get it for eight pound.
You know, it was very much that, but also like the rate that we would shoot in that studio, we would shoot like 90 to 100 looks a day at ASOS. That's insane. It's insane. Like, you know, and then the models are kept walking all the models, but it was, it was literally fast fashion. That's where that name came from. Um, but again, I think ASOS now gave me the skills of setting up an econ business and what that looked like.
So you obviously had the original idea and you had the concept that it was going to be for people who were tall and generally weren't able to find the options elsewhere, at least definitely not the ones that still looked the way you wanted them to look. And you obviously then went to ASOS. I'm really interested in how
At what point you suddenly decided, do you know what? I'm actually going to do this because there's obviously a big difference between having an idea. I think we can all get really stuck on having an idea and we can all go around telling people our business ideas over and over and over and not doing them is not doing them. Yeah. So I'm really keen to hear at what point you actually just thought.
I'm going to go for it. Why you thought that and how you kind of leaned in and actually walked with it. You know, at the point when I've really thought that, okay, this needs to happen was actually working at ASOS because all the models are tall and you don't realize when you work behind the scenes, just how much everything used to, not so much anymore, I would say, but used to get retouched. So the genes were never long enough, but we had a technique on a way to fold them and then they would just photoshopped them longer and photoshopped the crease out.
the tops never fit but they would always extend them and i remember thinking if these girls that you know i do an e-com are working in the modeling industry can't find clothes that fit then it's it's bigger than just me because i you know like i hadn't worked in modeling i hadn't worked on that back end but i was like these are two girls these are girls that are just as tall as me
So I was like, wow, there must be like, there's so many models. And that was the first time when I thought, actually, there must be a market. If I can source out where all these tour girls are, one and I just like make basics that they can go to shoots with and they can just have leggings and a long sleeve white vest, I mean, white tea and a white vest that fit their body that they wouldn't necessarily always have to like retouch. And then I was like, okay, if we shoot all the time, then maybe if I supplied lots of econ people, basics for tour girls and they won't need to retouch so much.
So that's really where the idea when I thought, okay, there must be a customer for it. When it transferred into me thinking about, okay, how do I crossover? I had, unfortunately, but fortunately, I had a car accident. And when I got paid out from that car accident, I was like, I've always wanted to go to Asia. I've always wanted to sort. I know that, you know, I read up about Guangzhou. It's like the hub. I just thought, let me just go, like, let me just see. And I use that money. I went to China. I went to Hong Kong.
Um, and I was like trying to like find suppliers, not very successfully. I'm going to be honest, but I was so inspired because I had been and I had tried. And I remember saying to one of my friends who also worked at ASOS at the time, I'd be like, I think I'm going to leave. I think I just want to just do my own thing now. And she was just like, I work on the buy-in side. Maybe you could just meet with some of our, but of, um,
manufacturers and see if they can do your units because your units are going to be significantly smaller than what they're used to. And I would say they gave me a list of maybe like 50 suppliers. And I would say, 49 of them said, no, that my units are not going to be enough. They're obviously used to like, you know, working with the A sources, the top shops, the H&M's of this world who are also and I'm sure as you can relate, like they're all doing night.
You know, a hundred thousand pieces. No, they're just like, no, sorry. So they were all just like, no. And then there was one supplier who was in Greece. And she was like, I think you're on to something here. I only do Jersey. So maybe you should just start with Jersey and then let's just see how it goes. So I was like, okay, I found a supplier.
Let's figure it out. Yes, we're doing Jersey. Yes, we're doing Jersey. And I never came into this thinking, I remember when I did my business plan, I had tailoring, I had Jersey, I had footwear, I had bed, I had home interiors, I wanted to do my own bedding. And then when you start to speak to suppliers, slowly and slowly, those categories get smaller and smaller and smaller.
That's what's so important though, because I think that what you didn't do at that point is go, okay, cool. Well, it's not what I want it to be. So I'm not going to do it at all. I think that like I go on and on and on and on about when you're starting a business, you've got to start with your minimum viable product, which is like, you've got to go to the earlier stage of what represents your business, sell it and start to get to know your customer because you won't get to know them until you're actually
Getting to know them like until you're seeing returns until you're seeing what they think about things until you're seeing what they don't like what they like all of this and actually what you did there was like first of all I'm so impressed that you took that money and like and just like I'm going to go to this place I've heard of in trying to actually like find the supplier that says a lot about you.
but then from that point, being told no and no and no and no and being given one option, it would have been very easy at that point to be like, cool, actually, I don't think this is going to work because it doesn't look like the business I thought I was starting. And actually, the fact that you said yes to that opportunity at that point is literally the reason your business ended up existing because you're obviously just like, okay, well, if this is what we can do, let's do it, let's learn and let's go from there. Yeah, exactly. And I think at that time,
I was just happy that somebody had said yes. And somebody actually believed in my idea. She was like, I think you're on to something. Let's make some samples and let's see how you get on. So I took those samples. I had no money. I was figuring it out. I had some friends at ASOS that they used to shoot. ASOS used to be really great. If you wanted to do press shots or test shots, they'll let you use the studios on the weekends. So I remember being like to the girls,
I kind of want to shoot like a look book on some models, but obviously if I say so look what they're probably gonna say no, but can we just say we do the test shoot and And we did a test shoot and I shot it on and I shot it on some of the girls and I shot it on all of the light Really like all the girls I knew a sauce that would sell
20,000 units of address. Like, you know, my friend Jamie Gunn at the time was like the ace or model, you know, and she was five foot 11. Again, everything was photoshopped on her. So I was like, let me just shoot with Jamie and my friend Natalie Solomon at the time. Let me just shoot with them two, you know, and let's just see how it goes.
And I remember shooting a lookbook. My friend was a graphic designer. She made it look all nice and fancy. And then I was like, OK, I guess I've got to go and find some supplier, find where I'm going to sell this. Because, again, I wasn't really thinking, oh, direct to consumer. Let me just set up the website. Let me just try and find my customer.
Because I had essentially been raised in retail, my go-to was like, I need to get it into a store and no one's going to care about what I'm selling unless I get it into the best store. Because I was like, I'm just this girl from South London who's decided to store a brand for tall girls. Why are people going to care about this thing?
And what year was this at this time? This was 13 years ago now. Yeah. So that was also very much within like, like earliest, earliest due to sea brands were beginning 2010s or a little bit earlier, but like it very much wasn't seen as the thing to do at all. Like you had to be cosigned by a wholesaler or a retailer and you had to, like that was brand. If you weren't that, then you were kind of some, like no one trusted searching off a website and putting your car details in and all of that. You were kind of like, oh, yeah.
But it's weird to buy something directly. Exactly. Yeah, it was tough. And at that time, also, I remember the supplier had said the minimum units that we can do, like bare minimum, were like 50 units. She was like, if you can just get someone, get a wholesaler that would do the minimum quantities, I can keep sampling for you. We can figure it out.
So going back to my Selfridges shop floor days, like their ethos, you know, like when you have your like staff training, their ethos was, we are the one stop shop for every type of woman, you know, and I remember like, from working there, I don't get me wrong, I knew all the buyers, like, you know, so I remember setting the meeting and being like, this is supposed to be the one stop shop for every type of woman. I can't shop here.
There is a wall in your strategy. It doesn't make sense. It's not adding up. So I went into that meeting so confident because I was like, I know how to get from the service lift on the other side of the building to hear, like, I know what they need. So I went into that meeting so confident.
i was pitching to a room full of men and i remember thinking they were like really like tall girls can't find clothes is it a thing and i was like okay homework on your train journey home when you're just traveling look to see if you see any tall girls and just look to see where their jeans stop look to see where their jackets stop just have a look and let me know and literally like two days later remember Gary messaged me and he was like
I saw a tall girl and she had ankle swingers and she was wearing free quarter-length boots so her ankles weren't sticking out. What do you need? Send us the line sheet. Then I was like, what's a line sheet? Then I was like, okay, I guess I need to put a line sheet together. So it was very much, I was figuring out things as I was going. And, you know, at the beginning, I was like trying to figure out, you know, how this thing was really going to work. But then Selfie just gave me my first order.
It was amazing. Selfridges to give you your first order. My first order was in Selfridges and it launched on net. And bearing in mind, all of this time, two years has gone since I've graduated and my mum's just looking at me like...
JOB much like a serious JOB not like working on a shop floor or like figuring things out because in between I Went to work for a shamanine at war Just to like obviously get some money on the side. I was doing like club night So, you know, this wasn't my be all on the end all like I still had bills to pay I still I know people always ask me all the time like You know
Am I losing focus if I'm doing too many things? And I just remember thinking I couldn't afford to lose focus, but I also couldn't afford for it to be my only focus. You know, I had bills. I had like, you know, things that I needed to take care of. So I would work, you know, on the weekends, I'd work at, you know, from nine p.m. to three a.m. in the club. And then I'd work on TTYA from nine o'clock until I had to be back in on on.
in the evening. So I would structure my day in a way that allowed me to prosper, I would say, but I wouldn't necessarily recommend it because it's not everybody that is built to do free jobs and still come home and be dedicated enough to write that business plan to figure out what a line sheet is to build the back end of your business. So I will say I had to work to be able to fund myself, but also I was meeting customers, I was still keeping up with my community.
I worked for, you know, a club night called Yoyo, which was in Notting Hill Arts Club for a very long time. And that was really, like I said, the intersection of where, you know, Western, back then, you know, it was mixed groups, hard soul shoes. They didn't really pay much Afro beats or hip hop music. So this was the first club night where it was come as you come as you are, express yourself, you know, and it was started by
two guys, seven cheerleader, green state, and their resident like DJ was Mark Ronson. So like every night, you know, every week, sorry, it was a first day night, the club fit 250 people, we would have 1500 people outside. And I was the door girl. So everyone wanted to be my friend so that they could get in. But I remember like seeing brands like trap star coming in hustling, putting in their t-shirts in pizza boxes, giving it out on the night, you know, like we
you know launch didn't we are always first single so all the artists used to perform and then like it was almost like a marketing stop on their press talk tour but for us it was just our club night and we were having a good time but what that also allowed me to now think about is when i was doing my brand seeding like i could get things to people
So even if I had one or two samples when I was working in the clubs, I could still give them out and distribute them. And then the vice president of Marriott used to come to our club night and was like, listen, I'm opening this hotel. It's going to be like the go-to. It's going to be like Studio 54, you know, in London. It's going to be cool. It's in a hotel. It's going to be called the addition. I want you to come and work for me. And I was like, okay, sounds good. As long as I can work nights, I can work on TTYA in a daytime and then I can work in the club at night.
And so we moved from Yoyo to the edition, and then we ran the basement, and we curated the nights, and I did everyone from Alexa Chung's birthday party to the new cause drop for Jordan and Nike. But then all the talent VIPs would stay at the hotel. So I would hustle the doorboys to put TTYA packages in the room, and then I think Kylie Jenner will one of my T-shirts, and then that's when it really blew up when I first launched themselves.
At that point, obviously, that is an incredible journey. And I think that one of the big things that ties this all together, for me, hearing this story from you, is there was never an opportunity that you didn't take. You are very clearly the type of person who will see something that someone else might not see as an opportunity, and you're like, this is an opportunity, even you moving from one club night to another, and then somehow getting your things in the celebrities' hotel rooms.
It's, it's a risk to take. It's an opportunity to take that a lot of people wouldn't have seen the opportunity to do. Where do you think that came from in you? Hustler, hustling. I think seeing hustling, growing up, like, you know, like you said, there's always an opportunity. I'd never look on the bad side. I always think, okay, like, this isn't where my angle is going to be, but this is where I am now. And how, how does this opportunity service me? And, and I say that,
not in a two-day way of like 2D way sorry of just like, oh I need to use this opportunity to my benefit. I enjoyed working in the club nights. It actually like, you know, being a solo founder is quite lonely, you know, like, you know, I would work all days on my own. So working in the club at night time,
was almost my community and was a way that like for me to express myself and like to connect with other people and like build and they were almost like my nighttime fam I would say but also like yes there was an opportunity but I was only able to get that opportunity because I was friends with everyone from the head chef to you know the room service boys like everyone was my equal everyone was my peer like everyone
worked as a community together it wasn't just like oh I only need to be friends of the VP and not speak to anybody else it was actually like the people on the ground and that's why I always say like even now for me it's always grassroots up like it's always one foot on the ground like what are the kids doing like what's happening on the streets like always one foot connected to community because that's what's kind of built and shaped every opportunity that I've had across my career but also for me
It's allowed me to be like, okay, these are the guys that are really going to support me when I have nothing compared to like, oh, everyone always thinks, okay, networking is networking up to people that can mentor me or people that are in really important positions. But I always say, don't forget that people that are around you that can also support and help you. Yeah, no, absolutely. I think that's really, really, really important. What was it actually like day to day? What were some of the first challenges you really came across?
It was really hard day today. I think one of the first challenges, I remember my first order, my first selfages order, my mom drove me to the selfages warehouse, which was in Birmingham at the time, because they have a set window that you can deliver the product. And if you missed a window, they charge you. So I was so scared because I didn't know how you deliver it in time and deliver a pallet load of product on time. So my mom drove me. And so when I got my ASOS order,
My first ASOS order, it was so big that it came on a boat and I didn't realize that basically you have to ensure you're from when the product goes onto that boat until your brand, it goes enters your wholesalers warehouse, you are liable for that bit in between. And I didn't know that at the time. I just thought,
My factory makes a product and they deliver it to where it needs to get to sorted. On that journey, some of the products had got damaged, some of the boxes had got damaged by water. So by the time they had got to ASOS, they couldn't be used and they had to be destroyed.
and i remember thinking oh my god i haven't fulfilled my order they're gonna charge me what am i gonna do i'm gonna i didn't i didn't anticipate having that buffer for this product and again because my supplier had been with me from the beginning so she had done my first
order 50 units per style to now I'm getting thousands of units per style she'd seen my journey and she said you know what will remake the product and we'll send it to them but you need to get your insurance sorted girl you know and honestly for me that was the hard slap of business of knowing that you have to know every element of what's going on and also never assume I assumed
that it would be covered by both entities and didn't inquire so now it really taught me the hard lesson of like never assume but also just like I always say there were so many hard lessons or hard times but I do generally feel like the way that my life has always panned out it's almost been like a domino effect like one thing has turned into another which turned into another which is open another door
So now, like, and it's very easy to say in hindsight, but I do welcome the challenges because I think at the time, when you're stressed out, you don't realize that the challenges are actually the best bit because they make you a better business owner, they make you a better manager, they make you a better co-worker, and you need those things to happen to be able to morph you into the new version of yourself. So when I look back now, at that time, I was just like, oh my God, and I think it was like 250Ks worth of product.
I was like, what am I going to do? How am I going to cover it? But overcoming that, I would never make that mistake again now. And I think when you're a solo founder, you do every element of that business. You are merchandising. You are buyer. You are designer. You are marketing. So it's great because when you do employee people or you freelancer or ad hoc, whoever you need as and when, you have worked in every single department at every level.
Yeah, it's so true and I do think that part of being a founder you almost don't want to rush. I think it's really interesting because I have a business course and I remember someone asking being like, don't you need to make these mistakes yourself? And I was like, do you know what?
First things first, I was like, I think it's incredibly important for the people who've been through it to share as much as possible, because I could help you on a thousand things for you not to forget, and there will still be a hundred that you do forget that you didn't think about, and I didn't tell you and all of this that will somehow slip through the cracks.
and you're going to end up paying for it and you're going to end up learning and like I think this is why first of all this is why I like to have these conversations because I think as many issues as we can clean up for anyone doing their research when starting a business that we can stop happening to them perfect but like rest assured I promise you you can read every business book under the sun do every single course and like you will still be slapped in the face like five times a week and you're just like okay
Yeah, literally just like, this is fine. This is fine. Everything's on fire. But it is so true. And I think that you would have learned so much within that time that also enabled you to be better at every single part of the business and every other job you go into. Like there's so much beyond just doing that business, that building those skills quickly, which you do so fast for an entrepreneurship is incredibly important.
Yeah, for sure. And I think that even just learning the fundamentals of just like, you know, I didn't know how much retailers like mark up your cost price. So even just being across that and like understanding the business of retail now morphed into when I started working with talent and music and like, you know, like now doing merch deals and like now doing like, you know, behind the scenes.
or doing pop-ups with artists, now my retail experience is what has allowed me to be knowledgeable and have an expertise in that area. So people are now looking at my expertise because I've been through it and I've done it. And most retailers at that time were marking up times 2.5 times free. So I always used to tell my family, if you go into a retail shop, how you know how much I think really divided by free or divided by 2.5, you'll know what they bought it for and then you can probably work out what it actually cost to make.
Um, but then it transferable skills and I think now, you know, setting up TTIA and like even going into TTIA talks, it was exactly for that reason of what you've just said of like, I wish I had more people around me than that were doing what I were doing. I could ask, obviously we were like,
free social media age, right? Facebook was probably our biggest platform at that time. But, you know, now it's so easy. Everyone's so accessible at that time. People weren't accessible. You have to think about how much strategically can I get into that event to speak to that person or how many times can I guess what this person's email might be
Let me see if I can find their colleague who's got their email on their Twitter page and I can try and figure out what their email would be. It was real hustle in season, I would say, which the kids maybe don't necessarily have as much now things to do, but that was also part of the thrill and the chase. It was just like, you just have to figure it out. And there wasn't a lot of people that looked like me or were doing what I wanted to do, that I had connections to to ask.
So everything was that DIY entrepreneur, I was like, do it yourself, just figure it out. So when I started TTYA talks, it was literally a platform so that I could be like, well,
This was my first collaboration. This is how they screwed me over. This is what I learned. Your lawyer is your best friend. And so is your accountant like, you know, like really like giving tangible takeaways. It wasn't just like, Oh, I started my business and we made X amount in a year one. And it was very much, I actually, this is where all the fuckups were. And actually this is what I've learned. And also here are other peers that may not be at CMO level, but are doing pretty well. Here are my peers that can also give you some further insights. And then that's how that was bought.
Yeah, no, and I think that's so important and such an incredible idea in terms of like I believe so strongly that actually Teaching people and telling people what you went through like it's how I save myself from a like, you know a thousand mistakes as I've said still made hundreds more But like it makes such a big difference. I'd love to hear the
thought process behind being like, okay, now this is the next stage of my career, because I think a lot of people see their careers as very one track minded. And I think we can probably learn from you there. Yeah, for sure. I think it's also important to note that I think it's okay to transform. I think there's lots of transferable skills that you learn from point A that will get you to point B. And I've always, I would say, because I worked in nightlife, I've always kind of worked at that intersection of fashion and music lifestyle.
And from working at the clubs, the talent used to come to me and be like, I even froze the littest parties. Can you do my album launch party? Then it was like, oh, then it evolved into, I think I want to do merch or like, how do I build my brand? You've built a brand? How do I build my brand? So then you think light bulb moment, actually, there's so many skills that I've learned from like building my brand and
and understanding the logistics on the business. And actually, there's so many transferable skills that I could put into talent and business. And the real kind of switch over time for me was actually COVID because a lot of my business, and we are speaking about the real side of business, right? So like, a lot of my business had been through the whole cell.
kind of template, right? So what that did was when I did try to push the DTC, people were so used to like going on to other platforms to buy a TTYA that I wouldn't really get as much orders through my own platform. Or I always had to think about doing maybe another colorway exclusively on my site that wasn't available in Telphages or on ASOS to actually get the consumers to come. So when COVID hit,
Those suppliers over time were doing a lot of the other bigger retailers. So when COVID hit, even before COVID hit, a lot of the times I had to be flexible with my timeline because if a bigger order came in for a bigger conglomerate, I went to the back of that production line. Now how that feels?
girl. So then when it came to COVID, basically they were just like, we don't really have time for these. You've, you've, you've grew the business steadily, but we kind of really don't have time to do it in a timeframe that you need it in. And obviously everything shut down at that time.
And I was just like, I had maybe recorded one episode of the podcast before, like, with Naomi. And I was just like, well, actually, everyone's at home now. So maybe I'll just chat to all my friends on Zoom and record it and make it a fun time. And at that time, then, you know, obviously,
with George Floyd and a lot of that kind of, you know, resurgence in like what it means to be a Black founder, how the Black community are seen in a commercial lens, what the Black community are going through via the corporate lens. You know, brands started asking me to maybe like, do I have an opinion on this? Or can I speak on it? You know, we were going through our whole Instagram live phase. So I would join loads of different lives and like have loads of different opinions on things.
And then for me, it started to open up my world a bit more. Like a lot of the talent that I had worked with, I'd always kind of maybe consulted with them before like per project. Oh, I've got this album coming out. Can you help us with this? Or you know how to do this little event? Can you help us with this? And so I hadn't really formed as a business identity. It just was kind of just like, oh, I'm just like helping this person do this. So I'm just connecting this dot over here. Or, you know, if someone was coming into London, they'll be like,
I mean, the plug, you need to call her. She can get you wherever you need kind of vibe. So then when COVID came, a lot of people were just lost, including me. I didn't know what I was doing. Was I now influencer? I was on Instagram 99% of the time. I was trying to also figure myself out, like, what am I doing? And it's so crazy because I actually had probably the most in light. And, you know, we know,
A lot of people passed away, a lot of people weren't able to see family members, but Covid for me was a time where I was actually able to stop. There was no such thing as FOMO, everybody was inside, everybody was in their house, everything came to a halt. And I think Covid for me was a real mirror in front of my face.
who are you? Like, you know, you've built this brand, you're helping talent here and there, but what do you actually want to do? And also, how are you going to make money? Because right now, this business that you're doing is not going to be sustainable because none of the factories are open. So we're going to have to, we're going to have to morph girl, we're going to have to figure it out. And I will say with TTYA, I have always
I am literally my mother's child. So even though I had this whole business going on, I was always like consulting here or like, you know, I'll do like huge focus groups for YouTube or go and do like huge like consultancy for like Nike and some of the bigger brands, right? And like allowing them to understand community or, you know, I'm a tall girl. I don't fit into this space. This is the, you know, you're excluding this narrative, like you need to be more inclusive in this way. So then now TTYA became more than just a fashion brand. It was actually
A voice and a platform for me to be like, well, I come from the excluded girl. We're never forefront. We're never thought about. I come from an excluded group. I am the black woman who usually is in the bottom of the hierarchy pile. What does that mean? What is, how am I lending my voice to that? How am I supporting my community?
God has blessed me with the opportunity to be at the forefront of culture with my brand, but actually there's a whole heap of people behind me that now you do have that social responsibility to be able to speak for. So that allowed me to morph into entertainment because, and it was, it was, it was authentic and it was organic, but also for me, it was a way to make money.
I need to make some cash doilers. And right now, all my factories are closed. We can't meet up. I've got to be thinking of other ways of to generate revenue, you know, and it was a difficult time, you know, that first two that that two year interim of COVID, if we want to call it that, but it was a difficult time. And I decided to take a full time job at that time, because I felt like
I kind of wasn't really, hadn't really figured out the factory element to produce clothes. The podcast was doing okay, the live events of me bringing my community together couldn't work in real life because obviously we had social distancing, et cetera. So I was given the opportunity to take a job to basically do what I was doing for my brand.
but just for other people. And I was like, okay, I get to work with talent and I was kind of already working with outside of this ecosystem. And I can see where there's opportunities for growth with that talent. I also get to learn my voice to like be the person that I wish I could, like I had when I was younger in those rooms, you know, at C-suite level now. I was like, my title needs to be this. I need to be able to do this. I need this ABCD if it's gonna work for me.
And, you know, they gave me everything that I needed, they gave me the setup that I needed, but also for me, it allowed me now to be, have that seat at that table and be like, well, in the last five years, I've seen that you've only worked with this kind of influencer and, you know, not every day doing power to the people, but also like,
understanding how grassroots culture impacts the music industry, impacts fashion, impacts style, you know. So, you know, being that voice at that table to think to say, have you thought about it this way or maybe you should think about this, not everybody with a million followers is the answer. Like there's actual people who don't have a million followers that are just as impactful to their communities, you know. So actually sometimes let's think through the lines, let's make sure that things make sense.
Whereas I think when you work in like really corporate ad agencies or music agents or like everyone's kind of engineered a bit to think the same way. So like for me it was just like now being in this social corporate climate but still being my true authentic self.
Yeah, no, I think there's so many ties of your story and how you've taken all of these opportunities, but how you've made yourself so completely yourself, rather than squashing these different parts of who you are in order to make yourself a businesswoman or in order to make yourself go and do this full-time job or whatever it might be, rather than doing that,
actually growing all of the parts of you that make you you by taking all of these opportunities and then presenting it back and being like cool so I don't fit in this box and that's the good thing like that's exactly why you should hire me and that's exactly why you should work with me and I think like that feels to me at least from an outside perspective like what you've done through all of these different industries and I think it's really really admirable. I also just think that
like you're so clearly not afraid to not just take opportunities but to as you say transform and like change trajectory completely or not even completely because I understand that it's building on these different things but I can imagine why lots of people being put in your situation and having the factory issues and all of this would would be like oh no if I take a full-time job then I'm
failing at my business or I'm not doing this. Was there ever a point that you thought that and how did you overcome that? Because it feels like you went into it so confidently and I just know I know my mind and I know what I would think despite the fact that you've got like the most incredible job and I think it's really easy to let what other people think of us and our own career trajectories change what we actually want.
No, I think for me, TTYA will always be a part of who I am. Like I literally, you know, it started off as, you know, taller than your average. And I am she and she is me. It was two in one. It was a package, you know, and even if I'm more, even when I'm morphed into my into a full-time job, it was still carved out that I could do my company. Like, you know,
they knew that that was again I am she and she is me you know so but I think it was important that within TTYA the ecosystem allowed different bits of the business to flourish at different times so when I could no longer produce clothes and we came back out of the whole like you know social distancing I could go back into doing live events but rather than just like
Making it a closed room. It was more about like, okay, this is now kind of morphing into mentoring, you know, and thinking about legacy of the brand and what that's going to be, you know, it is essentially I'm giving tips and tools, but also I'm creating a space where there's community where I'm giving back information, but also, you know,
I don't necessarily have the time to mentor 100 people one on one, but if I can provide a safe space for them to come once a month or like fee free that they can tap into this or ask me this or figure out this along the way, then that bit of the business is going to excel at that point, you know? So, okay, cool. I haven't made product or haven't done this for a while, but things always come back and heat some waves. Like, you know, I didn't do product for almost two years.
And then during COVID, I remember going to ASOS and being like, hi guys, me again, you know. So can we talk about shoes, you know? And like, throughout that whole time being at home, because I had the time to think, even though I was more fit into this new role, I was still designing the shoe collection.
Because I was like, there's girls like me who are like size 42 and above. I don't have shoes, so like now I've got to do up to UK size 15 shoes. And I put out a shoe collection of ASOS and it sold out in a week, you know? So sometimes it's also having the faith in those partners.
And that's why I said, ASOS will always have a special, like no ad, no, like, you know, big in anybody up in particularly, but they will always have a special place in my heart because they allowed a space for me to be confident and come with ideas and execute the ideas. I didn't have coins to go and do like shoe molds and design a whole new, I was just like, I think we should do this.
you have the infrastructure to do it. Can we do a TTY in CoLab? And it worked, you know, but also if it allowed me to test ideas, not on my own customer, you know, so, and then that's still fed into like, now you see the whole resurgence of like, you know, WNBA and like, we look at like,
Amazing athletes like you know angel Reese and like you know I I am almost in all of those girls because they own that tallness like it was nothing I'm just like the confidence that they all eat like they all ooze and like they've made tall women cool like people look at them and just don't think oh there's the big friendly giant or go stand at the back of that photo They look at them as business entities. They see them as entrepreneurs. They're looking at them as experts in their field They're seeing tall like the third or fourth thing down the line
Whereas I'm like, this is so amazing. Oh my god, there's a whole new pool of women now. And I guess working in entertainment does give you that access now because you are seeing the other side of the coin. And I think TTYA, I was the founder. I was the talent. I was front of house. So I knew what kind of deals I wanted. I had broken terrible deals for myself at the beginning and learned all of those mistakes. But now that gave me the flex to be able to
broke her amazing deals on this side and also like know what we should be asking for. You're thinking about it as talent yourself. You know you want glam, you want grooming, you're thinking about, you're thinking about all the things as if I was talent or when I was talent, what would I want? And now I'm in a really lucky position that I get to do front of house and back of house simultaneously. Yeah, but you made that laugh. You can see like you can see so clearly how much you've like curated a career for yourself that doesn't fit in one box. And I think that
It's so like, I get terrified all the time. I'm like, am I this? Am I this? Am I this? And then I'm like, oh, gotta be more like this because I'm technically and this and all of that. And it can hold you back so much. And I think that you're such a good example of like,
don't let that happen. Unless you want it. You can want that and you can run with it. But do not let yourself be put into a very specific box and then say no to everything else around that just because you're in that box. It doesn't make any sense. And I think you're such a good example of someone who's truly molded and curated your own career.
Very quickly before we end, I just want to touch on a homeowner chef, because you are very impressively bought two properties on your own. That is incredibly impressive. But you've also shared a lot of that journey. What's made you want to share that journey and want to share the reality of being, especially a black female solo homeowner,
like statistically I know like that's so incredibly important to share and talk about and like be like actually it was like this and actually it was like this.
where did you get the idea to kind of just be like completely transparent about it all? I think it came from again my community like the girls my school my I have like I would say like my creative friends that I work with and like and entertainment side with me and then there's like my my childhood friends that I grew up with and I went to school and I went to college with a lot of my friends I went to grew up with
did some of them did go down the academic route. And a lot of them had properties, six or seven, some of them have with their partner, some have done HMOs, some are landlords, some are just doing, you know, just had bought their own. But they had inspired me on that side to be like, they kept saying to me, this thing that you're doing, this rent in that you're doing, you need to, you know, you need to jazz up. That's like, it's quite an undoing thing to say. You need to jazz up. Like you need to like, you need to come on to this side now. So they inspired me. They were always pushing me like, when you're going to get your house, like,
You should save this. Let me introduce you to my broker Let me introduce you to and I remember like when I was looking because I was like I'm really struggling with a broker the first two brokers that I went to They were male and they basically said to me that I should wait till I get a partner to think about it's gonna not look good as a female on my own Trying to buy a house. I should maybe think about well, literally like they should they were like you should maybe think about
Because if you combine incomes, you know, your threshold of what you're going to be able to borrow is going to be a bit better. I get that. We all know maths, right? You don't say it's going to look bad. And it's more because they could see, you know, like when you meet them, they can see your face a day.
can see your face today, I'm like trying to like, you know, moonwalk backwards. You know, combined income. And they were basically saying that it's not going to look good, you know, as a woman. And then like, again, through conversation, speaking more with my friends and me like, guys, I'm really trying to do this thing. Like, can you help me? Or like, do you know anyone? Can you introduce me? Who's your broker?
and they introduced me to my broker, she was a female boss, like, badass, she was like, my whole career has been about helping female entrepreneurs, like, women who are bossing it, like, I live for it, you know? And she was very much like, you need to do A, B, C, D, E, F, G, you need to like, stop spending so much on Amazon, you need to, your accounts need to be cleaned, you need to like, you know, she was very much like, step by step, you need to do this, you need to do that, let's like, work on this, let's work on that.
and my first place I bought
on the exit side of COVID, and I bought somewhere that was a little bit further out outside of my comfort zone. Still in South London, but a little bit outside my comfort zone, but allowed me to make the space, my space. I got at it, you've seen the videos, you can go and have a look at it, but it was, I remember like when I had such a terrible experience with builders, like honestly, like the whole process of buying a house
If that, even the site being let down like going through properties, viewing site, you know, like that whole up down emotional rollercoaster actually physically by the space. And then when you're renovating it, connecting with like builders and make like, I used to have to like, like ox my male friends to be in the house when they would come to view because the price that you get when you're there by yourself, but as the prices that you get when you have a male friend present, two very different places. I'd put like a building degree on the wall. I'd be like, this is my.
It's my property to go. And I even like working with tradesmen, like trying to get tradesmen to like do a job. I remember like, I looked into underground heat, underfloor heating and I was like, called a very well known like plumbing company. Can you come and give me this quote on this? They gave me a tentative quote on the phone, came to the house. He was like, looking around. What's your partner around? I was like, stupid. I used to be so naive. No, it's just me.
all of a sudden that quote went from 700 quid to three and a half thousand pound we need it's a two-man two-day job you know i was like i looked at and the thing is i always used to do my research i used to go on youtube i used to watch videos on videos i used to watch people doing it themselves so then i was like no like you know this is the flow and return you just need to do this you just need to do that i don't know why it's a two-man two-day job he was like okay i'm just going to go to my van to like you know
Um, so check in with HQ. I didn't see that guy again. You know, but it was just things like that. I've just haven't always have like a male presence. And then when I did have builders, like I fell out with my builder that was doing my extension. Like I don't feel like he listened. He was never on site. He outsourced the job. Like he outsourced the job to a third party. He was never there. Like I'm a part.
Part of the time you say to me, just calm down. I know you're a micro manager, but just calm down. Sometimes in building, things don't go to plan. If they say they're coming today, if it's raining, they might not come. I'm expecting you, rain, sleep, shine, snow, to be at my house at 8am.
So there was a lot of that understanding how different industries work. But also, for me, I very much always felt like I wasn't really being listened to. Or if I say I want something this way, no this way is better. But I don't want it that way. I want it this way. And I'm paying. So surely you should listen to what I have to say. But I think my second property was a lot easier to manage because I had so many mistakes. And I learned so much about the industry on my first one. And then my second one was just a by-telet. So it was literally, again, another Renault
rented. I've got tenants in there now, which is interesting. I'm a landlord, which is crazy. But I also, for me, when designing my second home, I was like, I want to create a space that I would want to live in, because when I was watching so many videos, people would be like, oh, don't be too personally attached. Don't get emotionally attached to your rental property.
Like just do the bare minimum, get your tenants in and make your money back. And I was like, but I remember like when you're at uni and you move to halls and how scary is, you know, when you move out for the first, and I was like, I want to create a space that kind of looks like my house, but feels warmly and maybe not done to like the same spec, but feels like I would want to walk in there. If I don't want to live in it, that's not a space that I'm going to create. And I feel like that's what the energy that I put in. And like literally it was on the market for a week and it was going, you know, so.
I think, again, being a landlord is interested has come to its pros and cons, but also, I think, fighting for your voice to be heard and not be afraid to say, like, when you're not happy with something, I literally fired my builder halfway through the build-up as a site. I know this is going to cost me more money, but I'm not having no one to suspect me, you know? So, again, it was just like that constant fight, but also, I was a site. I'm not going to have no one to suspect me, so it's my money.
I know it really makes you, like, honestly, renovating somewhere makes you re-evaluate a lot and, like, get very, very clear on what you are and on. Okay, with, like, yeah, it's such a journey. Like, my brother was like, whoa, it's gonna be years till I do that.
Do you know what? I didn't say that. When I did my first one, I was like, I am not looking to animate it, but then an opportunity came because it did itself. And you know you, you don't say no to an opportunity, but it was this. So I was like, oh my God, it's so cheap. The kids didn't want it. Like, I want to take it. So my second one didn't happen on purpose, but I'm glad that I did it. Again, it was an opportunity presented itself and I just thought, well, might as well. I know. And so before we end, I'd love for you to share the best piece of advice you've ever been given.
The best piece of advice I think I was ever given is... I would probably say...
Don't be afraid to ask for what you want. I think when it goes back to like my first ever collaboration that I did for TTYA, I was just so happy to be there. Whatever money they were paying me, I was doing maybe six or seven jobs in that partnership. I was just so happy to be there. I didn't really see my value in what I was bringing to a partnership.
And the best advice to someone game is don't be afraid. It was two things in two parts. It was know your worth, know your value, but don't be afraid to ask for what you want. And because I was just so happy to be there, I was so scared to be like, this is wrong, but I don't want to lose opportunity. And I just think whenever you do a partnership,
But if the two people in that partnerships need to have a mutual understanding and should, if the understanding is growth, you should both be growing at the same rate. Your business can't stay here and it's a part, it's a collaboration or it's a partnership. And then the other person's business is here. It's not a collaboration, then it's not a partnership.
So I would just say, like, know what you're bringing to the table. Is it your community? Is it your insights? Is it your network? Is it your, you know, is it your design? What are you? Is it your IP? What are you bringing to the table? And don't be afraid to ask for what you want. Add a couple more zeros because you'll be surprised. People will say, my budget is this, but surprisingly, when you're being like, well, this is my bare minimum, I would do it for suddenly more money comes into the budget. So don't be afraid to ask for what you want.
And I think that's such good advice. Thank you so, so much for joining me. This has been so good. I feel like it's a very, like, it's one of those episodes you're going to listen to it on a walk and come back and you're like, right to work. Thank you for having me. This has been so fun. I've been, like, listening to this podcast for years, so I'm just so happy that you have invited me on. So no, not at all. It's our pleasure. Keep shining, sis. This is a beautiful platform you've created. So thank you so much for having me.
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