This BBC podcast is supported by ads outside the UK. BBC sounds, music, radio, podcasts. So let's begin the new year in a new way with some racing tips from Laura Coonsburg. Well, I wish I could give you some. I am looking over a fabulous race course at Charles Ford in Essex. However, I can see no Gigi's, not a single one, not a single Fettlock, also single whoosh. Why are you at the races in Champsville?
I have gone to the races because Naja Faraj is here, and I'm going to interview with him for tomorrow's programme, as he, interestingly, is the first of the main party leaders to be sort of out in about this year, and he's at his second event in 48 hours. He's going round various bits and pieces of the country, as he proclaims his ever-expanding membership of his new party reform, I suppose actually not so new now reform UK, and he does what he
seems to often do so well, captures headlines, not always for the right reasons. Well, it's come at a time when his friend Elon Musk and hero, of course, Elon Musk has been making comments about the British judicial system and he wants to jail one of our MPs now, which we will discuss in Saturday's newscast.
Newscast from the BBC. I like landscape. I don't think I'm being rude. Japping. Unemployed people who are overweight. That is not the agenda. It's the fun police working overtime. The Star is Born Milan. So hurt that America let us have. Actually, I think we need a British Trump. Take me down to Downing Street. Let's go have a tour. Blimey.
Hello, it's Patti in the studio. And it's Laura, as discussed at the races in Champsford. So this week we have seen Happy New Year, by the way, Laura, nice to hear you again. And to you and to all new testers. Happy 2025. Hello, I'm a bit keen to get off from the starting tape because it has been another intervention by Elon Musk into British public life. It's quite incandescent. He's backing the far right jailed figure, Tommy Robinson. That's not his real name, but he likes to go by that name.
and he says that Jess Phillips should go to prison and he says that the British are wrong basically to have not called a national public inquiry into child grooming gangs.
It is quite extraordinary, and I think if you go back six months, if you said to Dubolent Labour staffers, if you had just won an election, in fact, exactly six months ago, if you said six months in, the world's richest man, who by the way seems to be busymates with the president-elect,
is almost daily having a pop, but some of our politicians in this country in incredibly inflammatory ways, I think they just thought you were absolutely off your rocker. I mean, this is an extraordinary series of events, and you know, Musk is not shy of causing controversy. It's not the first time that he's read instead of G.K. politics.
but it does seem to be on a daily basis taking a more extreme bet on, I suppose. And as I look out on some of the gathered reform UK members, some have gone out for a crafty fact-break in between speeches, there's a pizza don, a burger don, a coffee don, I can see in front of me.
This is the kind of thing, this right between Musk and the UK government that gives oxygen to Musk and his ally, his political friend Nigel Farage. But it's also very, very difficult for Nigel Farage to manage this, because just as some voters think, well, isn't Musk what you can say is a hero, he believes in true speech, he can say is whatever you like.
Other people are going to think what he's saying is completely unacceptable and crosses the line of anything that might even vaguely resemble civil politics. So a lot of this is in the territory of where our colleague Marianna Spring works, it's how conspiracies grow. So if we just look at some of the big primary colours of this,
For many years, grooming gangs in parts of England got away with their crimes for too long, most people admit. And we could all of us begin by talking about victims. They were predominantly working class girls, and we should perhaps focus on them. They were let down, they were victims of crime.
One of the things that the grooming gangs had in common was that the men were from British Pakistani heritage. It was said on the public record, but too late, that the authorities had been overly sensitive. They didn't want to appear that they were pursuing on racial grounds. So there's a problem there for the British state, which it has to acknowledge and deal with, and it has been said that they have failed, as has been said. However, Tommy Robinson has been whipping it up.
And Elon Musk has backed him against the British government. And Tommy Robinson is a problematic figure, says Nigel Farage. So we're now in the position where Farage is trying to rein back Musk. Let's just have a listen to what Nigel Farage said.
I have a history in America of being asked questions about Tommy Robinson and making my views very clear. He's a campaigner, he does his own thing, he gets some things right, but very often I don't approve of somebody who's been to prison on five separate occasions for different things.
Right, Laura, shall we review why he's gone to prison? Tommy Robinson. Well, Tommy Robinson is in prison because he admitted to breaking the law in October by repeating false claims about a Syrian refugee. And there are also examples of other previous offences that he's committed, content of court, actual bodily harm, mortgage fraud, possession of drugs. And then you can hear there, Raja Faraj, very much trying to distance himself
from Tommy Robinson. And in fact, if you go back into the sort of history of Nigel Farage's rollercoaster political career, he expended a good deal of his own political capital actually trying to sort of distance UKIP, his previous outfit from Tommy Robinson. And he actually left the party when some of the other people in UKIP had sort of Tommy Robinson as part of their wider fraternity.
So this is history there between the two men. That's why this is so awkward when, you know, one of his new big bezi mates who just happens to be absolutely minted and also bezi mates with currently with the president elect. That's why it's so awkward when Elon Musk has been calling for him to be freed. So you see there, and Madre Farash really trying to put distance between himself and Tommy Robinson. What he hasn't been so much pressed on is whether or not he thinks it's acceptable for Elon Musk to be intervening in this way at all.
is probably a great disadvantage that we share the same language with the United States because we don't really understand them and they don't really understand us. Elon Musk, broadly speaking, is a rich man with a rocket. We don't normally care about what these people think about the United Kingdom. We share a language. We don't need to know what Elon Musk thinks, except
has been pointed out to us on Discord, people who are kind enough to follow us. People have been conversing with us kindly on there. And let's just have a look at what some of the Discorders. This is Andrew T. This chap called Elon, what's his game if he sneezes every media outlet reports on it? And another one said, Alex Davis says it is tricky because if he was just a rich guy who bought a social media platform in order to troll, the media would be straightforwardly wrong to give him a platform.
But he's also said to be one of the most powerful people in the incoming US government and rise between US and UK governments do get covered. And that is probably correct. So it said, as we heard from those different comments, people are going to have different views or whether or not to what extent it really matters.
that this man appears to be sort of trolling parts of the British government on some of the most sensitive kinds of issues that you could possibly imagine. But it's a really fascinating moment because you see that Nigel Farage and reform which have been growing at an incredible rate of knots. I mean, they are planning and hoping for very significant political success this year.
Let's make no bones about that. And they have benefited from some of the oxygen and some of the backing that they've had from Donald Trump and Elon Musk. But this is a really interesting moment because you wonder, does this kind of thing, where he's wading into this very sensitive route, does this kind of thing really help or hinder reform at this moment in time?
And are they worried? Great question. You've got the man in front of you tomorrow. Yeah, so we're doing one interview later on this afternoon, and it will be on the tellybox tomorrow, and we'll have plenty to talk about on tomorrow's newscast. But I don't know what he's going to say about it, but it's a really interesting moment to be having this conversation. And also had the government because, you know, what was he meant to do? They don't want to get into a row with Elon Musk. And so far, this is all they've had to say publicly on the matter. This was West Street, same house secretary a bit earlier.
what we would say, whether it's real or must, but frankly other leaders of big social media companies and social media platforms, they've got a big role to play to in keeping young people safe online, in preventing exploitation online and supporting law enforcement
online as well as in the physical world. So Elon Musk wants or anyone else that matter wants to roll their sleeves up and work with us on this serious issue. We're all is and we're willing to do that. I think some of the things he said criticise in this government have certainly been misinformed if not ill-judged but we're willing to work with anyone including Elon Musk if they want to use their power, their influence and their platforms to help us tackle what really serious issues around child sexual exploitation.
Let's just lay out here what, you know, Musk's wading into because with the help of our discorders, we've all agreed, I think we have to pay attention to Elon Musk. It would be easy to ignore a rich man with a rocket under normal circumstances, but you don't ignore a rich man with a rocket whose best friends with the incoming president who wants to give money to reform, which wants to gain with that money, wants to gain seats with questions for how we fund our political system. So it's obviously
perfectly sensible to talk about it. And the IT is what kind of inquiry should there be into the child grooming gangs? Whether the inquiry that is called for is held as a national public inquiry in which witnesses are compelled to attend and must give evidence under oath,
or as can be done locally, as has happened before. And the previous government, which was a Conservative government, did not accede to a demand for a national inquiry. And the new government, which is a Labour government, has not acceded to calls for a public inquiry. So I hope that's a fair way of saying newscasters can divide on their opinion about whether there should be a national public inquiry or not, knowing that neither government, Conservative nor Labour, granted one. So you've got difference of political opinion.
It's quite another thing to say that a jailed contempt of court, actual bodily harm, false passport here has got the solution to this difficult problem in the United Kingdom. That's a different thing to say. It is a different thing to say. And also, if you read the kinds of things that Musk and other people have been saying on the internet, it gives the impression that there has never been any form of inquiry, that nothing has ever happened, that this has somehow continually been swept onto the carpet.
Now as you absolutely rightly point out, there is a very now well understood, well worn trail that has shown that many vulnerable girls in particular kinds of communities were terribly let down and were ignored by the police or concerns dismissed and the whole thing wasn't taken seriously enough by any measure. However, to give the impression
that there has been nothing in the public domain about this, that since there's suddenly a new fact that no one has ever considered these, that is just not true. And this reporting that goes back on us in fact back to 2004, then a lot of reporting, particularly by the excellent Andrew Norfolk from the Times, through the 2010s, if that's what we call them these days. So the idea that this was ignored, and nobody's ever talked about it until we all must suddenly realize is what's been going on, is for the birds.
However, was there a hideous problem? Yes, has enough been done. Well, the author of the national inquiry into different forms of child sexual abuse, which can take included elements of this Alexis J. She says, no, absolutely not. There was a big national inquiry, which included some of these concerns.
And she would say that there hasn't been nearly enough done about the findings. And some of the people who've been involved in this space for a while say, look, we don't need to have another inquiry. There've been lots of different kinds of inquiries. What's actually needed is people to get on and do the things that would stop these kind of appalling abuses actually happening in the first place.
Yeah, and of course, I mean, it's great that you name check a journalist who's done the work because what's happening with the quick fire comment area at including Elon Musk is that often they don't do the work. It is absolutely important for people to have freedom of speech, including Elon Musk, but it's very helpful if what you say is correct. And one of the problems we all have as journalists is that you're not allowed to shout fire in a crowded theatre.
And free speech is not without limitation. So free speech does not mean that you can make up damaging things about people. Free speech does not mean that you can say things that might incite hatreds or violence. So there are limits on free speech. And when people just say, oh, well, it's free speech in this kind of very, very sensitive debate.
You might feel that in your bones that the technicalities of is that that is not true. And also just remember last week, Nantafarash threatened to sue Kemi Badenock for saying he made up his membership numbers, because in rich context she wouldn't have had the free speech to say something about his membership going.
If it was incorrect. So, you know, the point about this is whether or not these standards are applied equally and also if they're applied safely. And one of the things we've talked to Nigel Farage before about is actually about the safety of politicians. And you just wonder in the context of 2025,
Is this debate where Elon Musk and others are hurling accusations at labour politicians like Jess Phillips saying that she is basically a rape apologist saying that the Prime Minister of the United Kingdom was somehow complicit in rape? Are those things that make politics safer?
Or are those things actually something that threatens to make our politics more dangerous than it already is? And that brings me back to why this is quite tricky for Nigel Farage because he's somebody, he's been attacked himself with a milkshake, which he would be the first person to tell you isn't a funny thing to happen. Absolutely. You know, our leading politicians have to have security on this day and age.
politics can be extremely toxic. And yet, then if this sort of, you know, this is, again, it takes us back to Elon Musk. So interesting. He's not technically a politician, but he's a massive political voice. And by stirring up these kinds of things, is that making this debate safer for people to have in a rational way?
Well, in the lifetime of this weekend newscast, we've gone from being a country with legitimate concerns about immigration to one that fire bombs, hotels, and migrants are staying. So that's happened in 12 months. Now this all came home in a public meeting for reform. And this is another interesting moment. Now this canary has started singing conspiracy theories a light. Let's just listen to Lehan Anderson. He was at the East Midlands Conference in Leicester.
And he's, it's Reformed's own audience. And someone in the audience tells him, listen to Tommy Robinson. Just this week, Labor's... Look, are you going to shut up or just go out? Do you want to come up here and speak?
Do you want to come up? Well, that's just a little snapshot there, isn't it, by the way, of the fact this is tricky for Reform's leadership who want nothing to do with that element of the rights. However, you can hear faintly in that clip somebody who turned up to one of the events that's the kind that I'm at here today in Chelmsford takes a different view.
And we know if we go back a few months, we know also Reform UK had lots of problems with some of the candidates who came forward for the general election and some of the kinds of views that they had expressed and they disavowed some of the people who's been attracted to the party in the past. But I would just underline, in as much as this is a kind of tricky moment,
people in and around reform UK, not least with the new money bags coming in from net candy, potentially money coming in from other donors, they are convinced that they are on to a very, very rapidly developing
accelerating conveyor melt that is going to take them to being a really significant political force. And I think, you know, what they tell you that they're doing now, publicly, overtly, obviously, is growing a very hungry membership and getting ready for 2020.
And see, here's another thing that's true is that a lot of promises made by the political classes weren't delivered. So the perfect breeding ground for conspiracy and anger and hate is if you can say the system doesn't work. Oh, they're all the same. They're all the same. And so here are just a few things that happened. David Cameron,
promised to Brexit referendum and would stay as prime minister whatever the results. The result went the way he didn't want and he left. He was the same man who promised us legal migration in the tens of thousands and now under conservatives and now with the Labour people in, it's at record levels. That's what actually has happened.
Then we had a situation where we were told that we would be addressing the concerns of the voters at a general election, and Labour got in with a landslide on 35% of the vote. Reform have five MPs only, but they would argue the system is unfair. So you've got what you need more than ever is informed political debate from adult people. And I've said it before, Laura, it's the politics.
We need politicians, we need political debate that's informed, we do not need shouty angry people on X. Isn't it interesting though, as I look out across a very lovely but very grey Essex, is that I'm looking at a marquee that is going to hold more than a thousand people turning up
to speak, to listen to a politician on a Saturday afternoon. It was the same in Leicester last night. It's likely to be the same in Eastshire, in Surrey and in Chester, and then in another part of Essex in a couple of weeks' time. And I'm not daft enough now to make good predictions about how far reform might be able to go. But right now they are able to tap into something in a real way. And if you look at their polling,
They're consistently within touching distance of the Tories, nipping at Labour's heels as well. And, you know, we talked about it before Christmas, didn't we? The two big parties are very worried about this. And frankly, they ought to be.
Yeah, fascinating, because I interviewed John Curtis on radio for over the holiday period. Christmas period, just for listeners who think I don't use a word Christmas. Christmas, happy Christmas, happy Christmas everyone. Over the Christmas period, I interviewed him over Christmas and he said that it's roughly
sort of five-way now. You've got three big parties all in the 20s, Labour, Conservative and Reform in the polls. And then to our listeners who are in Scotland, Northern Ireland, Wales, you're effectively looking at five national parties all over the picture. So it's a great time to be doing the political leaders. I'm sure you're doing them all this year, aren't you?
We are certainly hoping to. Yeah, that's the plan. In the next few weeks, we're hoping to, in January, where I can speak to Arco Summer and Kevin Maynock and David. So maybe, if we manage to get that, I'm just going to say hat trick. That's not a word. What's a quad trick or four?
I don't know, a quad over January. I'm not quite sure if everybody's down. Is it going to line up completely how I would like them to? But yeah, that is definitely our plan in the next four weeks. So I'm going to say it's going to be an interesting few weeks for us to get on with. And of course, later in the year, we'll also be speaking to John Sweeney, the first minister from the SMP and various other people because, and the Greens and all the rest is what an interesting patchwork we have. What I would say, though,
So it sounds like the old, boring, skeptic, not cynic, skeptic. I have also covered many moments when esteemed professors and other learned columnists and people have predicted the end of the fall of our two-party system that has lasted us for hundreds of years.
And then actually, it all changes and an election comes along where the two big parties absolutely knock it out between each other and completely dominate the landscape. You know, we talked about it during the coalition years, for a long, long time. We talked about it post-Brexit, and the SFP was massive in Scotland and all those things. Just beware of the learned prof.
telling you exactly how it is. Oh, I can see Lil Yumerson actually just walking along it's anchoring where I am. I've got a great bird's eye view. I'm up in the, I don't know, the clubhouse. Would you say that as a race course? And I can see all of the form great and good gathering in front of me. Hmm. I think we'd call that we could be in the box. You could be in the in the Royal Box, perhaps, if it goes. Do you know what? I'm actually round the back of the bar.
which is where you're often to be found. It's a bit more on brands for me, frankly. There you are. This podcast is brought to you from round the back of the bar. Is that meant to be me? You've already done a bad essay exactly. You can take the woman from Glasgow.
So anyway, look, I feel we're at an end and we've got, we'll have the evidence of the interview with Nigel Farage when we will meet tomorrow. We will, and we also go, and we're stressing the Health and Social Care Secretary, who at about the 99th time of asking, where's your plan for social care in one of our red chairs on a Sunday morning? He will actually be able to say, aha!
Here it is. Except the plan actually is to take several years coming up with another plan. But anyway, we'll be talking to West Jesus more about NHS reform, social care and no doubt how the government plans to handle or try to handle either mask if indeed they plan to do anything at all. What are you doing?
Well, we're doing the news coverage of the weather. We're out on snow patrol with distance, looking out for vulnerable neighbours who are flying solo, people who live on their own. We're also meeting the author's lead child and Mick Herron to ask if TV adaptations can ever be better than books. Ooh, interesting. I think the answer to that is yes, actually. They certainly can be. I'm glad you agree, because we think it would be an interesting parlour game. We know what name the adaptation is better than the book sort of thing. Yeah. Oh, that's funny. And we will all meet here again
Tomorrow. Well, I look forward to that as long as we reunite us. And I'll be with you in person. And I'm the Good Ship, ABC, some more. All right. Goodbye. Goodbye. Newscast. Newscast from the BBC. Thank you so much for making it to the end of Newscast. You clearly copyright, Chris Mason. Ooh, stamina. Can I gently encourage you to subscribe to us on BBC Sounds?
Don't forget, you can email us anytime. It's newscast at bbc.co.uk. And if you would like to join our Discord community to talk about everything newscast related, there is a link in the description of this podcast. And don't be scared. It's super easy to click on it and then get set up. Or you can WhatsApp us on 0330-1239480. And I promise you, we read and listen to every single message. Thanks for listening to this podcast. Bye.
Yoga is more than just exercise. It's the spiritual practice that millions swear by. And in 2017, Miranda, a university tutor from London, joins a yoga school that promises profound transformation. It felt a really safe and welcoming space. After yoga classes, I felt amazing.
But soon, that calm, welcoming atmosphere leads to something far darker, a journey that leads to allegations of grooming, trafficking and exploitation across international borders. I don't have my passport, I don't have my phone, I don't have my bank cards, I have nothing. The passport being taken, being in a house and not feeling like they can leave.
World of Secrets is where untold stories are unveiled and hidden realities are exposed. In this new series, we're confronting the dark side of the wellness industry with the hope of a spiritual breakthrough gives way to disturbing accusations. You just get sucked in so gradually.
and it's done so skillfully that you don't realise. And it's like this, the secret that's there. I wanted to believe that, you know, that
Whatever they were doing, even if it seemed gross to me, was for some spiritual reason that I couldn't yet understand. Revealing the hidden secrets of a global yoga network, I feel that I have no other choice. The only thing I can do is to speak about this and to put my reputation and everything else on the line. I want truth and justice.
and further people to not be hurt for things to be different in the future. To bring it into the light and almost alchemise some of that evil stuff that went on and take back the power. World of Secrets Season 6, the Bad Guru. Listen wherever you get your podcasts.
